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Democracy

Fellow ladies and fella Master-Debaters, discuss serious topics.

Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 1st, '12, 18:31

Unlyricallyrics wrote:Why not? Computers could make the best possible decisions because they wont let emotions or their opinions affect anything. They wouldnt be greedy like humans or wouldnt get blinded by power or anything like that.


It's exactly because they don't have emotions. Then you would get the scenarios where the computers would think it would be better for the majority if they killed off like 10% of the population or something like that. That would not be good.

And simple like, people vote, you get elected or you dont. Of course that's pretty simplified but still it's rather simple.


That's what a democracy is but that's an extremely oversimplified version of our democracy. Basically your whole argument is "Democracy has it's flaws so we should change to another form of government, however I don't know what this form of government would be and neither does anyone else but we could probably come up with one"
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Re: Democracy

Postby Unlyricallyrics » Nov 1st, '12, 20:43

classthe_king wrote:It's exactly because they don't have emotions. Then you would get the scenarios where the computers would think it would be better for the majority if they killed off like 10% of the population or something like that. That would not be good.

Youve watched too many movies. Computers do only what they are programmed to do. And even if they came to conclusion that 10% of the population should be killed it would still require humans to actually do it.

classthe_king wrote:That's what a democracy is but that's an extremely oversimplified version of our democracy. Basically your whole argument is "Democracy has it's flaws so we should change to another form of government, however I don't know what this form of government would be and neither does anyone else but we could probably come up with one"

Yes exactly. Democracy has it's flaws so we should change to another form of government. Like i said before, first thing people need to do is to understand that democracy isnt the ultimate form of government. I find it hard to believe that it is impossible to come up with better one.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 1st, '12, 22:07

Unlyricallyrics wrote:Youve watched too many movies. Computers do only what they are programmed to do. And even if they came to conclusion that 10% of the population should be killed it would still require humans to actually do it.


That's the point of AI. They don't do what they're told, they think on their own.

classthe_king wrote:Yes exactly. Democracy has it's flaws so we should change to another form of government. Like i said before, first thing people need to do is to understand that democracy isnt the ultimate form of government. I find it hard to believe that it is impossible to come up with better one.


And I think it is impossible.
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 1st, '12, 23:11

classthe_king wrote:
CrashBand wrote:Anything that doesn't mean one person has full, unquestioned power.


If the person did a great job though then there would be no problem. ***** give me the crown and I'll have this country fixed before Eminem releases his next album

Who decides what a 'great job' is. People disagree on so many things regarding politics.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 1st, '12, 23:19

CrashBand wrote:
classthe_king wrote:
CrashBand wrote:Anything that doesn't mean one person has full, unquestioned power.


If the person did a great job though then there would be no problem. ***** give me the crown and I'll have this country fixed before Eminem releases his next album

Who decides what a 'great job' is. People disagree on so many things regarding politics.


People disagree on things before hand but no one can disagree with results. The country is either better off than when you took office or it's not. No Republican is going to hate on FDR because he did a great job.
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 1st, '12, 23:21

Yes, people do disagree if what they have done has been good and if we should keep doing it.

Someone with unquestioned power is a stupid idea.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 1st, '12, 23:34

If they're stupid, that's the point of having a dictatorship cause he could do what was best for the people even if they couldn't recognize it.

And omfg no shit. I was talking about in a fantasy, perfect world. Get some imagination and stop thinking about things too much.
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 2nd, '12, 01:42

I think it's an incoherent idea.

There couldn't be a 'perfect' decision that is the 'best' for people as people disagree about things and have different values.

Who gets to say X is the best outcome for people.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 2nd, '12, 02:06

CrashBand wrote:Who gets to say X is the best outcome for people.


People who are knowledgeable on the subject.
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 2nd, '12, 02:13

I still think it's an incoherent idea to get the 'best' outcomes for people in many, let alone every, situation.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 2nd, '12, 02:58

CrashBand wrote:I still think it's an incoherent idea to get the 'best' outcomes for people in many, let alone every, situation.


That's why it would never happen in the real world :unsure:
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 2nd, '12, 03:01

I don't think you could imagine a world where it could.

I feel it's an incoherent idea.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 2nd, '12, 03:16

I guess I just have a better imagination than you :flutter:
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Re: Democracy

Postby CrashBand » Nov 2nd, '12, 03:23

classthe_king wrote:I guess I just have a better imagination than you :flutter:

I guess you are just imagining a world where everyone needs and wants the same things and have the same values. So there would be no contradictions with the 'best outcome'.

But then, I'd doubt you would need a dictator for this.
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Re: Democracy

Postby classthe_king » Nov 2nd, '12, 03:38

CrashBand wrote:
classthe_king wrote:I guess I just have a better imagination than you :flutter:

I guess you are just imagining a world where everyone needs and wants the same things and have the same values. So there would be no contradictions with the 'best outcome'.

But then, I'd doubt you would need a dictator for this.


No, I'm imagining a world where everyone is given what they need. Obviously not everyone should be treated the same, and I couldn't give a shit about their values.
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