Is Recovery a true comeback album?

[Jimmy Conway]

I enjoy the Relapse era more so the Recovery. There are some really good songs on Recovery. But overall I enjoy Relapse better. So i would call Relapse a good comeback.

[electroencephalogram]

yea i fink so

[EminemBase]

@Amadeo - For once I agree.

Relapse was hugely satisfying. And the only truly disatisfying song was the one most love "Beautiful". Because it sounded like the cousin of "When I'm Gone".

Sluggish, predictable emotion and self-loathing. Where as hearing him cut people to pieces and eat their corpses with chainsaws and hammers with a gleeful psychopathy and love for words = massively entertaining.

[Rindain]

^ Nah I doubt it, can tell from the way he speaks he's a tard with comps / this realm.

I think Paul informs him of feedback.

He does have the line "Google it until it pops up." And he has talked about the perverse shit you can find online.

So that hints he might know more than he is letting on, especially how he has said he doesn't know what sites to visit. He could just google it.

Maybe he tried it a few times, found that it drove him nuts, then stopped. Who knows?

[Manny_Boi]

bro that story was cool

[EminemBase]

^ Nah I doubt it, can tell from the way he speaks he's a tard with comps / this realm.

I think Paul informs him of feedback.

He does have the line "Google it until it pops up." And he has talked about the perverse shit you can find online.

So that hints he might know more than he is letting on, especially how he has said he doesn't know what sites to visit. He could just google it.

Maybe he tried it a few times, found that it drove him nuts, then stopped. Who knows?

Yeah but you can tell that's just his ploy to seem relevant lmao like he's in on everything. Which is the reaosn he name-drops and mentions little pop culture shit, to seem he has a handle on everything.

But you can tell he knows fuck all about how to operate online, the way he speaks about it is typical of somebody who's totally unfamiliar with it. You know almost like when you hear an old lady say like...

"Would you be able to transfer an email onto my hard-drive?"

Or something lmao, but just to a lesser extent. Can just tell he ain't bluffing.

[Rindain]

^ Nah I doubt it, can tell from the way he speaks he's a tard with comps / this realm.

I think Paul informs him of feedback.

He does have the line "Google it until it pops up." And he has talked about the perverse shit you can find online.

So that hints he might know more than he is letting on, especially how he has said he doesn't know what sites to visit. He could just google it.

Maybe he tried it a few times, found that it drove him nuts, then stopped. Who knows?

Yeah but you can tell that's just his ploy to seem relevant lmao like he's in on everything. Which is the reaosn he name-drops and mentions little pop culture shit, to seem he has a handle on everything.

But you can tell he knows fuck all about how to operate online, the way he speaks about it is typical of somebody who's totally unfamiliar with it. You know almost like when you hear an old lady say like...

"Would you be able to transfer an email onto my hard-drive?"

Or something lmao, but just to a lesser extent. Can just tell he ain't bluffing.

Dude should tweet more. I know he said he asks other people to do it for him, but there was that one tweet where he said that it was really him typing it.

Reach out to the fans man! Be like Kanye!

[Emadyville]

Relapse was his comeback album cus it was the one he released first. Like it or not, all his albums are a reflection of him as an artist cus they are all made by him. I'm not buying all this "the last two didn't count" stuff.

It's as simple as that.

word, i feel the same, i hate how he's tryin to just write them off and give reasons why they sucked

[EminemBase]

@Amadeo - For once I agree.

Relapse was hugely satisfying. And the only truly disatisfying song was the one most love "Beautiful". Because it sounded like the cousin of "When I'm Gone".

Sluggish, predictable emotion and self-loathing.

Yeah. When I'm Gone was horribly written. But... maybe it's the Stan in me... I still appreciate the sentiment of it.

Someone pointed out on this board that he may have written this as a swan song (because he thought he might die soon)... which makes it interesting to listen to. Even if it's poor writing.

Yeah, well I don't neccesarily like "When I'm Gone" or "Beautiful" as stand-alone songs, because... Yeah well they are what they are but they were an accurate reflection of his mindset and it still sounds like he puts his all into them even if they are sluggish due to the obvious reasons.

And I'm still glad he made them. But it's not something I'm vying for. It's predictable and I can guess what he's going to say next, which is something the true Eminem always fought against. Just something meh about his emotional shit to me now. It's like yeah Em I get it, I'm fucked too but to be honest he rarely takes appreciation of what he does have...

He's a millionaire who is worldwide respected as an artistic genius, often quoted as one of or thee greatest rapper of all time, he has people sucking his dick from every angle anytime he needs a little ego-boost, he gets to spend his life doing what he LOVES AND make money from it.

I mean it doesn't get any better than that lmao. But given the fact I'm a depressive cunt I still relate and sympathize with his constant unhappiness in general. Still though, after a while it's just like... Alright Em, stop fucking bitching and make something original. Because in 2009 he said he made Relapse like that because he didn't want to do what he was doing in his drug phase, self-loath and complain etc.

YET, as soon as that doesn't connect he suddenly starts 'pulling out of the drugs' (so he says) and sees it all differently lmao. And does the exact type songs "Talking 2 Myself" / "Going Through Changes" was criticizing. The fact he knew was Relapse was like and why he was doing it even when he first did it shows he wasn't just delusioned by some newfound drug glee at all lmao. He's just using it as an excuse now.

[Emadyville]

^ but embase, how does the drug pahse itself fit into the whole serial killing thing then, or is like he himself said, just trying to say shit that would get people dropping they jaws again?

I'm just curious what you think, what you just wrote I agree with 100%

[EminemBase]

^ but embase, how does the drug pahse itself fit into the whole serial killing thing then, or is like he himself said, just trying to say shit that would get people dropping they jaws again?

I'm just curious what you think, what you just wrote I agree with 100%

Well for me, I think I could see what he was doing and I think Relapse is more than just pissing people off. IN actuality, what he did on MMLP was pretty much just that, it's just his execution and everything going on at the time which just made it such a masterpiece.

But with Relapse, I feel he had a better handle on how he was perceived as an artist and really put work into putting himself across as an almost... All-powerful gleeful menace to society running through the streets chopping people up, polluting the minds of the young... I mean he's always been aware of that of course but... Well take for example "3am", I just feel the album was a concept and he was trying to do something bigger and better with his art which was... Free-expression to the fullest. Just let his mind run totally wild, say whatever comes to mind next but within the context of this little killer / drug themed context. It's just so tightly presented and well-written.

And I think a lot of people fail to see the humour in it. Like a lot of critics calling it far too hollow or humourless etc. when in reality there's a ton of humour in it. But I feel only people with a dark and subtle sensibilities like him will pick up on it all. And I'm not talking about shock stuff, but it's layered with lots of sick tongue-in-cheek and detail, it's so good.

Also his phrasing on the album is wonderful. He phrases things much more like a real writer / poet as opposed to... Himself in a way lmao, but it connects so well. I just feel he was trying to make a higher art (whether he admits it or not / or even knows it lmfao - but it certainly looks this way to me) out of the psychopathy but most people simply didn't get it.

Because most people / even fans could not separate the REAL Em from this image he was portraying on Relapse. He was much more in character than ever before. But people had become so used to him being so personal from TES onwards that it's almost like... They could no longer separate real Em / entertainment Em. Like they attributed his cruelty as him in his art as HIM in real life... Which is just, well the very thing people did when he first come out. I feel he's almost dug himself into a hole by being so honest and personal on TES and Encore, which he would now have to seriously struggle to climb out of to do anything of any real artistic merit again. IN terms of fictional freedom. It would almost be like people holding Tarrantino accountable for words he put into the mouth of one of his characters...

It's like, if you're going to portray an image at all - As an artist, then do it to the fullest or as free of compromise as possible / you see fit or why bother at all? And I just think people couldn't see that with Relapse. They were treating it like Eminem coming back to say some stuff and "oh why's he keep taking about killing people, he has nothing left to say" instead of seeing it as an exploration into dark mentality, almost like a fucking study of it... On record. I think he did it fascinatingly well and the MIND-BOGGLING skill he did it with has been totally overlooked simply because people wanted something else and, again, could not see it as stand-alone art but rather as Em's personal thoughts.

I saw him on Relapse like a kind of painter flicking his lyrical brush strokes throughout a twisted world of madness. I say it in that way as it's very nuanced and neurotic. There's no bullshit bravado image or personal crap (aside from the jokey shit)...

Instead, he just totally committed to this mindset and ran free with it. Which is exactly what a real artist should do. And that's why I say Recovery is a step back. Because he spent almost an entire album so worried about this new perception of him and trying to justify himself. I mean he basically wasted a disc in his collection sniffling up and apologizing for having the balls to trust his creative guts. But as soon as that was put into question, he immediately retracted this. I feel Relapse was a step into higher territory - Kind of like what Kanye is trying to do now.

In just letting his ideas become his reality, full-blown. But Em has now gone back to arguing with himself and his fans in his music which is just... So annoying. But I still love Recovery regardless.

Fuck, sorry that is FUCKING long. Didn't intend to say all that. And I'm still pissed off as I don't feel I've explained all of what I mean that well, I just can't quite get it all out properly. Like, precisely what I mean about it.

QUICK ADDITION - Just to summarize on a point which really bugs me about him wasting the Relapse era is... Like I say - He just allowed his fiction to become his reality again. Like on "Kim" instead of just talking about killing his wife, he makes the entire song him actually killing his wife.

And on like "3am" instead of just talking about killing people, he wakes up after a black-out and he has killed a bunch of them and he takes you through a killing spree as it happens and... He was just getting back into what I feel was his proper domain, namely; creating realistic / atmospheric, intense music out of whatever fucked up thoughts pops into his head.

Now people say the subject matter is limited on Relapse but how could it be anything else when he starts with a song like "3am". I'm actually annoyed he didn't commit to it more and try make Relapse even more entrenched in the mindset. Like, shit like "My Mom" takes away from it. Because that's putting REAL Eminem back in the picture, out of context.

Now I'm not saying all I want is for him to just kill people. But I saw Relapse as the starting point, with him just happening to decide to explore more muder (lmao) as a choice of habbit. But the fact he chose to commit to it like that was a very promising sign to me. And now Recovery feels like he's tried to please people and it's therefore a huge step-back from Relapse.

Because just imagine the same intensity and visual emphasis he put into "Stay Wide Awake" in a different context. That's what I'm getting at, it was like the first step onto the mountain of madness but who the fuck knew what was on the way up or more importantly ON THE TOP!? But now it feels like somebody has told him to get down off the mountain before he falls, and he's complied.

I feel people weren't seeing the possibility of new direction and limitless exploration in what he did with Relapse and where he could of gone had he stuck with it. Instead they just saw their dislike in that particular album and I think failed to see the bigger picture. Failed to see WHAT it is exactly he did on the album for one, as opposed to just what he was saying and how (accent). Again, when I say where he could of gone, I mean had he stuck to the mindset he tapped into on there. I'm not saying had he continued talking about killing people, I'm trying to get at the essence of what he was trying to do with his writing and commitment to ideas.

[buffalo bill]

I think he did it fascinatingly well and the MIND-BOGGLING skill he did it with has been totally overlooked simply because people wanted something else and, again, could not see it as stand-alone art but rather as Em's personal thoughts.

I saw him on Relapse like a kind of painter flicking his lyrical brush strokes throughout a twisted world of madness. I say it in that way as it's very nuanced and neurotic. There's no bullshit bravado image or personal crap (aside from the jokey shit)...

Instead, he just totally committed to this mindset and ran free with it. Which is exactly what a real artist should do. And that's why I say Recovery is a step back. Because he spent almost an entire album so worried about this new perception of him and trying to justify himself. I mean he basically wasted a disc in his collection sniffling up and apologizing for having the balls to trust his creative guts. But as soon as that was put into question, he immediately retracted this. I feel Relapse was a step into higher territory - Kind of like what Kanye is trying to do now.

In just letting his ideas become his reality, full-blown. But Em has now gone back to arguing with himself and his fans in his music which is just... So annoying. But I still love Recovery regardless.

EXACTLY. Superbly put. I agree with every word.

[Cam_24]

Relapse was the comeback album every true Eminem fan was waiting for.

Most true Eminem fans suspected that by the time When I'm Gone was released, the man who wrote "My Fault" was kidnapped and hogtied in the Interscope office basement, and they replaced him with a lookalike (though fatter with gangsta clothes) who couldn't write worth a shit.

Then in 2008 they untied the little man in the basement and shot the fat guy in the face.

WORD

[flyingmonkey10]

Relapse was the comeback album every true Eminem fan was waiting for.

Most true Eminem fans suspected that by the time When I'm Gone was released, the man who wrote "My Fault" was kidnapped and hogtied in the Interscope office basement, and they replaced him with a lookalike (though fatter with gangsta clothes) who couldn't write worth a shit.

Then in 2008 they untied the little man in the basement and shot the fat guy in the face.

[katha]

Nah, I agree with the majority here. Relapse was a legitimate comeback, he had been embarassing himself for years and then put out a good album almost out of nowhere. Recovery may be a comeback in the public perception coz Relapse was largely ignored by the mainstream, but Relapse was the record that showed that he was still an an outstanding artist and songwriter.

Why does he denounce it now? Too influenced by fan reactions, reviews etc.? Or perhaps he was still in a bad place after getting clean and he doesn't like to think about that time now? Who knows, I don't know the man personally. He may genuinely think that Relapse is sub-par, for all we know. Saw an interview with Jonathan Ross he did to promote Recovery where he explained that he likes Relapse but thinks it's too narrow in focus, which struck me as more on point than the nonsense on Not Afraid.

ETA: Here's the link to the interview, he says it's too jokey here, too, that he wanted to get more "serious" etc., but none of the hyperbole about it that's on some Recovery songs. I disagree with the "listen once, joke is over" bit for some of the songs (Deja Vu rules), but I think in context it doesn't sound quite so damning:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBCzDAkvA0g