"Hip Hop Is A Lesser Form Of Music"

by **Block** » Jun 4th, '11, 04:28

MC, your argument seems to focus purely on what Hip Hop is known for.. You're focusing purely on rhyming and complexity. There are a lot more ways to be complex than simply writing astounding rhyme schemes. I'll use Adam Lazza, for example. Taking Back Sunday literally created a whole new genre of rock with the style of music they came out with. It was a back-and-forth complexity that had never been seen before. If you take the time to listen to any Taking Back Sunday songs from pre-2006 you'll realize what I'm talking about. Not only are their lyrics great, but the way they utilize their voices is amazing, and their harmony together over the instruments is astounding. That's a complexity that 99% of rappers will never achieve. That's not complex rhyming, but it's complex in a different way. Still complex.

Another example that I used was Rob Thomas of MatchBox 20. His lyrics aren't overly complex with rhymes (although they do tend to rhyme a lot for his genre) but the way he uses his voice is jaw-dropping. He has amazing vocal range that very few, if any, rappers have ever achieved without processers and all sorts of digital shits.

You're looking at a singular area of music / lyricism and totally blacking out the rest of what makes music, music. Not only that, but phonetics play a big role. If it doesn't SOUND good, who cares how complex it is?

by **dead prez** » Jun 4th, '11, 04:29

We shouldn't neglect the instrumental world of Hip Hop btw, which is thriving and is devoid of lyrics.

Artists like Nujabes, Oh No, Fat Jon, Nicolay

by **Devil'sAdvocate** » Jun 4th, '11, 08:54

2 different genre's of music,none is better than the other because each genre excels in aspects the other genre does not.

/THREAD

by **Xray** » Jun 4th, '11, 09:55

I'd kiss her on the cheek and tell her fuck hip hop.

Let's face it hip hop is all about lyrics. Music is instruments, melodies and mostly changing the atmosphere of a room or place with it's sound and less with it's lyrics. A great song made with less effort is much better than a great song made with extra effort. Simply because it comes off more natural. I'd imagine it was possible for the very first humans to sing, simply because it's more natural to sing than to rap. Can you imagine someone rapping back then? Hell no, because rapping is much more forced and it's getting worse by the minute. Do you ever wonder about how much rap takes from other genres just to make it a rap song? A sampled melody, sampled drums, sampled bass, sampled hook, and the rest...well the rest is all lyrics. Do you really think most musicians are dumb because they don't have as complex lyrics or any lyrics to begin with? I'd definitely say it's better for a rapper to be more musical than technical. Why? Because it's music.

by **Pllumi** » Jun 4th, '11, 11:39

I'm gonna state my opinion on this...

albums like aquemini or illmatic are more charismatic, so let's say a music listener has a prejudice & as soon as he pepps those albums he's gonna now that he was wrong... so, if an artist wants to produce an album that draws a tons of listeners, he will be doing an album that is let's say ''perfect'' in different kind of aspects & not just dope punchlines & syllable rhymes...

& those albums who really represent hip hop are gonna fade the listeners opinion those hip hop prejudices... albums like The Low End Theory are soulful & incredibly addictive even for non hip hop fans...

by **momentsgolden** » Jun 4th, '11, 16:30

Hip-Hop is more focused on lyrics. Other genres are more focused on the actual music. They are both hard to make and any person on either side trying to argue otherwise is wrong.

/thread.

No, not really. How "hard" something is depends on how many people do it and do it successfully. ALL genres are not "equally" hard to make. I have been into alot of Classical music lately and i totally agree with Eminembase...

EminemBase wrote:As, compared to say classical music, ALL genres are 'lesser' forms of music. The very best rock bands in the world for example: their very best musical accomplishments and sound structures are laughable in comparison to historical classical arrangements.

That said, Hip-hop could and SHOULD be compared to other related genres because argument does not NEED to be factual but simply logical. Master Chief has shown quite clearly that hip hop has more complex lyrics and therefore is somewhat greater. Diction has shown the greater melodies displayed by other genres which also makes sense. Now, question is, which is more important in terms of "music"... i'd have to go with Diction on this one.

Xray wrote:Let's face it hip hop is all about lyrics. Music is instruments, melodies and mostly changing the atmosphere of a room or place with it's sound and less with it's lyrics

How many atmosphere's have been changed by "Lose Yourself" How many people feel pumped up when listening to "not afraid"?! That logic is heavily flawed. Lyrics could just as easily influene and change the "atmosphere" of a room and I for 1... and the most of this forum... will concur that the words are powerful enough to alter our mood.

A great song made with less effort is much better than a great song made with extra effort. Simply because it comes off more natural.

It sounds more normal but no less natural. By creating music which is more than a whistle or inaudible hum, the human brain has already committed to an "unnatural" expression of self. Even great poetry writers who "sound natural" and "have a feeling" of words agree that time, effort and dedication are essential elements of great works.

I'd definitely say it's better for a rapper to be more musical than technical. Why? Because it's music

by **WinstonMARX** » Jun 4th, '11, 16:37

Yo Diction, don't even pretend Bob Dylan's lyrics hit on the imagery or emotion of a lot of rappers. He wasn't even poetic or complex but he had a lot of meaning and used a unique voice to transform genres BUT his lyrics were sporadic.

Yo Class, you act like rap is nothing but writing lyrics but it's not. I could probably learn to play guitar decently in the same amount of time it would take me to develop a decent flow and delivery. Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks.

Yo Eminembase, that is apples and oranges if I ever heard it. Of course classical music was far more technical and complex but that's not even what other genres focus on. Rock music has to be repetitive at some level to accompany vocals, a verse and a chorus somewhere along with bridges. Your argument that classical music is the best is about as valid as saying "Classical music just didn't have as strong vocals as rock music". Apples and oranges, as is this whole argument.

by **Devil'sAdvocate** » Jun 4th, '11, 19:47

WinstonMARX wrote:Yo Diction, don't even pretend Bob Dylan's lyrics hit on the imagery or emotion of a lot of rappers. He wasn't even poetic or complex but he had a lot of meaning and used a unique voice to transform genres BUT his lyrics were sporadic.

Yo Class, you act like rap is nothing but writing lyrics but it's not. I could probably learn to play guitar decently in the same amount of time it would take me to develop a decent flow and delivery. Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks.

Yo Eminembase, that is apples and oranges if I ever heard it. Of course classical music was far more technical and complex but that's not even what other genres focus on. Rock music has to be repetitive at some level to accompany vocals, a verse and a chorus somewhere along with bridges. Your argument that classical music is the best is about as valid as saying "Classical music just didn't have as strong vocals as rock music". Apples and oranges, as is this whole argument.

Yo mad

by **classthe_king** » Jun 4th, '11, 20:52

WinstonMARX wrote:Yo Class, you act like rap is nothing but writing lyrics but it's not. I could probably learn to play guitar decently in the same amount of time it would take me to develop a decent flow and delivery. Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks.

Really? I took guitar for six years and I was alright at it. I've been writing for two years and I have better lyrics than most professional rappers :coffee:

by **MikeNUFC** » Jun 4th, '11, 21:18

classthe_king wrote: I've been writing for two years and I have better lyrics than most professional rappers

I've been writing for 8 months and I have better lyrics than Sentus.

by **WinstonMARX** » Jun 4th, '11, 21:26

classthe_king wrote:
WinstonMARX wrote:Yo Class, you act like rap is nothing but writing lyrics but it's not. I could probably learn to play guitar decently in the same amount of time it would take me to develop a decent flow and delivery. Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks.

Really? I took guitar for six years and I was alright at it. I've been writing for two years and I have better lyrics than most professional rappers

...So after I point out that rap is not solely about lyrics you're counter argument is about how good your lyrics are.... :laughing:

by **Master Chief** » Jun 4th, '11, 21:26

classthe_king wrote:I've been writing for two years and I have better lyrics than most professional rappers

Multis don't equal better lyrics, little buddy. Just reminding you.

Oh and what about flow, delivery, content etc...?

by **classthe_king** » Jun 4th, '11, 23:10

^^^^^^Didn't see that coming :coffee:

WinstonMARX wrote:
classthe_king wrote:
WinstonMARX wrote:Yo Class, you act like rap is nothing but writing lyrics but it's not. I could probably learn to play guitar decently in the same amount of time it would take me to develop a decent flow and delivery. Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks.

Really? I took guitar for six years and I was alright at it. I've been writing for two years and I have better lyrics than most professional rappers

...So after I point out that rap is not solely about lyrics you're counter argument is about how good your lyrics are....

Really? How dumb are you?

Those take a long time to perfect as does writing lyrics. You said anyone could write a 16 but hell if you're not taking level of skill into account then anyone can strum on a guitar regardless of if it sucks

That's what you said. I'M the one in here that's been saying rap is more than lyrics :laughing:

Some people's failure to grasp things make me smh

by **WinstonMARX** » Jun 4th, '11, 23:18

Says the person who thinks because he played the guitar for 6 years and still sucks but is awesome at writing lyrics that it's like that for everyone.

by **classthe_king** » Jun 4th, '11, 23:50

lolwut

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