What makes Eminem so great?

[Fleka]

Like EmBase said, his talent. He makes fun, crazy, hilarious, serious, sad, real songs. He is the most versatile rapper ever. Eminem>*

[Devil'sAdvocate]

[Sam.]

Like that "Caps Day" you know...Imagine about 10 members posting like her

icwatudidthar.

let's go

[whiteamerica]

we should have known eminembase would come in here ranting about eminem's nuance.




for use of past tense on what "made" him great.

if you had acknowledged his new stuff as contributing to his greatness i'd have lost all respect.

[EminemBase]

we should have known eminembase would come in here ranting about eminem's nuance.

I'd hardly say I ranted about his nuance. All that proves is you skimmed my post and made an assumption. Which is fine, but don't be so cocky about it, when you're guessing.

I mentioned his nuance in one single line. The rest was about skin colour, wit and other things. And it wasn't really a rant either. Just a response.

[Mr Change]

He has a wide fan base because he's an absolutely... or was, an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist. What makes him (or rather, made him) so great?

Ya'know, I really don't like this. It's like your taking away everything because he isn't as good as he WAS anymore. He was an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist, and he still IS a genius lyricist and creative artist. Even if it's less than before, it still makes him great at this point in time.

[Jdubem]

He doesn't have a wide fan base because he does mainstream.

He has a wide fan base because he's an absolutely... or was, an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist. What makes him (or rather, made him) so great?

- His rhyming (pushed it to new heights)
- His flows (ditto)
- His styles and versatility (sounds different every album)
- His delivery (made rap incredibly realistic and daring, and 'live')
- His concepts and execution
- His detail and nuance
- His ability to turn mundane life tribulations into compelling art

I could go on and on. There are a million things that make him one of the greatest, arguably (and in my books easily) the greatest when he was at his best. His best wit is unmatched, the way he could juggle persona's and provoke whilst creating a political sentiment at once, just... so many things that set him apart and make him a writer, rather than just a rapper.

This bullshit of 'he'd be average if he was black' is nonsense as well. So, "Stan" - you seriously think that's an average song? if he happened to have black skin? The Marshall Mathers LP, an AVERAGE album if he had black skin? lmfao. It's such racist bullshit. It's like saying Jimmy Hendrix would be an average guitar player if white.

His rating has nothing to do with him being white. People always say that and don't explain how that'd even make a difference. That's implying that what, young white kids are going to say he's better because he has the same colour skin? don't be so ridiculous. Kids don't see colour. I could just as easily say 2Pac or any black rapper is overrated by black people, it's pointless, racist rubbish. Stop comparing skin colours and focus on the music.

Eminem is rated as he is because of his lyrics, and his music. Nothing else. If being white made you overrated, why aren't people calling Asher Roth or Bubba Sparxxx genius? that automatically makes your suggestion void and not true. Clearly, it's his talent. Whether black or white, he's head and shoulders above the rest, when at his best.

Even the second best rappers are just great to me, I think the word 'genius' gets thrown around too easily. But in the case of Eminem, it's deserved. Nas, is not a genius. 2Pac, was not a genius. Mos Def, is not a genius. They're all just incredible rappers. But none of them touch the sides of Em's innovation, balls, creativity and execution.

I agree with all of the things you said about what makes him amazing rapper. He is without a doubt an extremely talented artist and like you said arguably the GOAT. I wouldnt be here if he wasnt. That being said I also think his fame is atleast somewhat elevated by him being white. On average kids are more likely to identify with someone who is more like them. He looks more like them and sounds more like them and rather than talking about hustling like most black rappers do he talks about things that a white kid can easier relate to. He has sold more and has the largest fanbase of any rapper ever. Even subpar Recovery was the best selling album of 2010. Do you really think he would have accomplished all of that if he were black? I dont see it. Even Eminem has said as much.

[Mahmoud48]

he doesnt have a wide fan base???
thats the stupidest thing i heard

[Jdubem]

he doesnt have a wide fan base???
thats the stupidest thing i heard

who said that?

[Trimss]

Nas is a genius.. Songs like Rewind, Foetus, One Mic are genius.

One Mic is one of the best hip hop songs that has ever been made, it's somewhere near Lose Yourself.

[EminemBase]

Nas is a genius.. Songs like Rewind, Foetus, One Mic are genius.

One Mic is one of the best hip hop songs that has ever been made, it's somewhere near Lose Yourself.

I disagree.

For me genius has to be totally innovative and original beyond belief. Eminem was that, he presented new ideas in such compelling new ways.

Nas however, yes when he first came with Illmatic, he was ahead of everybody lyrically and it was certainly significant. But let's be honest, rapping about new york street crime, however well, is not innovative. It's not now, and it wasn't then.

Nas has done little outside of his original technical prowess to justify the title of 'genius'. He's just a brilliant rapper. I also don't think "One Mic" comes close to "Lose Yourself".

I don't think Nas period comes close to Eminem. Just look at their disses for one example. Yes "Ether" is a classic diss track, but compare Nas' disses which are essentially schoolyard tactics aka calling his opponent gay and turning everything into a pun. Compare that to Eminem's psychological dismemberment of his opponents ie. "Bully".

He methodically breaks down their psyche and keeps it lyrically, tight as fuck. And still makes it very musical and compelling. Nas is not that good.

Genius to me, when we're talking artists... has to include a spark of artistic creativity. Nas is too clinical and real-world to be a genius in my books. If you're in to great rap, Nas is great. But he's hardly a mind-blowing artist, in the true sense. Where as Eminem was.

[EminemBase]

He has a wide fan base because he's an absolutely... or was, an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist. What makes him (or rather, made him) so great?

Ya'know, I really don't like this. It's like your taking away everything because he isn't as good as he WAS anymore. He was an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist, and he still IS a genius lyricist and creative artist. Even if it's less than before, it still makes him great at this point in time.

When did I say he wasn't good now?

He's still a GOOD and sometimes BRILLIANT lyricist. But he's genius at the moment. Every artist I know of peaks and slumps, it's human nature.

I'm not taking away his present state, you're just one of those fans that want to say every single thing he has ever done or is currently doing is brilliant, end of lmao. A lot of the stuff he comes out with now plenty of other rappers can do too. And often do better.

Where as in his prime, he was in his own world. He has flashes of genius now but he's not consistently mind-blowing or truly great like he was. He's a different artist.

[whiteamerica]

I'd hardly say I ranted about his nuance. All that proves is you skimmed my post and made an assumption. Which is fine, but don't be so cocky about it, when you're guessing.

no. i read your whole post. just pointing out that nuance is a recurring theme in your posts attempting to describe eminem's greatness.

didn't mean to come off as cocky?....

I disagree.

For me genius has to be totally innovative and original beyond belief. Eminem was that, he presented new ideas in such compelling new ways.

while i agree with you about Nas being an overall generic sort of rapper. i disagree with your approach that one must be "TOTALLY innovative and original beyond belief" in order to be considered a genius..... that gives a huge advantage to those who came first in a given field. unfair advantage imo.

[EminemBase]

I'd hardly say I ranted about his nuance. All that proves is you skimmed my post and made an assumption. Which is fine, but don't be so cocky about it, when you're guessing.

no. i read your whole post. just pointing out that nuance is a recurring theme in your posts attempting to describe eminem's greatness.

didn't mean to come off as cocky?....

I disagree.

For me genius has to be totally innovative and original beyond belief. Eminem was that, he presented new ideas in such compelling new ways.

while i agree with you about Nas being an overall generic sort of rapper. i disagree with your approach that one must be "TOTALLY innovative and original beyond belief" in order to be considered a genius..... that gives a huge advantage to those who came first in a given field. unfair advantage imo.

Hmm not really as that's what genius is. Being able to take the current state, whatever state it's in and transform it into something original and brilliant.

Generally speaking you could say it gets harder to be original but... throughout history people have for example said 'everything that needs to be invented, has been invented'. And look what's happened in the past one hundred years alone. The staggering leaps of innovation.

By definition, you can't see what hasn't been done yet. With art, it's even more endless and accessible. As it's not about creating a solution to a problem, you can go ANYWHERE, and do ANY IDEA. So no, there's no excuse for doing 'the same old', other than being a bad artist.

I can think of literally... a fucking book's worth of ideas that I have never heard done in my life. And which a talented lyricist or musician could turn into wonder. People don't think abstract enough, they think formally, there's no rules, you can re-write the rules every time, there's no limits.

I mean seriously, just stop and think and dream-up an idea as you sit there now. Not a grounded, sensible idea, ANY fucking idea. I mean, there's no rules. Everybody treats it like there's rules like "okay, I have to do three verses and talk about X,Y,Z in this kind of fashion". Why not just make a song expressing a mood?

Or, let's say with Hell: The Sequel for example, why not make it a truly conceptual album of being welcomed into hell itself. And the intro is Eminem and Royce welcoming you, describing the dark, fucked up surroundings lyrically, using atmospheric music as a driving force and back drop, think of the sound effects, think of the possibilities. Instead, they just spit fucking punchlines.

Which just highlights how seriously limited in talent and thought gangsta rappers etc. are. I don't know how an artist could even bare to do the same kind of song twice, nevermind album after fucking album of the same, repetitive, primitive crap. COUGH 50 COUGH.

All the good rappers waste their talents too. The only one I've seen at least attempt to break free is Kanye. With MBDTF he was trying to just ignore sense and convention and just let his mind breathe through his work. I still feel he's just getting started and that the album was a turning point, and the start of his REAL career. Songs about your mother and college are fine, but meh. But "Power", "Hell of a Life"? that's more like it. It's visual, conceptual, he's following his fantasies and making them realistic and authentic. He's becoming a true artist.

I mean, even Em etc. they think so fucking small. It's so frustrating.

[Mr Change]

He has a wide fan base because he's an absolutely... or was, an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist. What makes him (or rather, made him) so great?

Ya'know, I really don't like this. It's like your taking away everything because he isn't as good as he WAS anymore. He was an absolutely genius lyricist and creative artist, and he still IS a genius lyricist and creative artist. Even if it's less than before, it still makes him great at this point in time.

When did I say he wasn't good now?

He's still a GOOD and sometimes BRILLIANT lyricist. But he's genius at the moment. Every artist I know of peaks and slumps, it's human nature.

I'm not taking away his present state, you're just one of those fans that want to say every single thing he has ever done or is currently doing is brilliant, end of lmao. A lot of the stuff he comes out with now plenty of other rappers can do too. And often do better.

Where as in his prime, he was in his own world. He has flashes of genius now but he's not consistently mind-blowing or truly great like he was. He's a different artist.

No, no, no you got me all wrong
I know not everything he does is brilliant and I don't try to call everything he does brilliant, and I more than well know he is not in his prime at this moment. I was just saying that some people like to down him on things now because it isn't as great as his old self, when in actuality it is still in a league of its own either way. && That's what I wrongfully accused you of doing I guess