help with songwriting 'n stuff

[pawel]

I was just looking for samples on the albums of Nas on wikipedia, and there's who wrote the songs too. on almost every single song there is a second writer or even more. sometimes more then just the person who features that track and/or the producer or someone who prolly wrote the lyrics of the song used as a sample. example:

13 "Nas Is Like" Nas

songwriters
Nasir Jones
Chris E. Martin
Paul Mitchell
Robert Bell
Ronald Bell
George Brown
R. Handy
C. Horne
Robert Mickens
C. Redd
Gene Redd Sr.
Gene Redd Jr.
Claydes Charles Smith
Dennis Thomas
John Bettis
Steve Porcaro

DJ Premier

Contains sample from "It Ain't Hard To Tell" by Nas, written by Nas & W.P. Mitchell

I was like WTF at that one. there isn't any other song with this many songwriters of course but there is a few with 5 writers 'n stuff...
so I was wondering, how big is the influence of some mc's themselves on their songs, and how big are the influences of the others, who 'help' or whatever they do. could anywone explain what the other writers do? (like, just checking things if they're ok, or just helping when an MC just don't know how to rhyme something 'n stuff)

[mart85]

that song is a particular case... the song samples a song that has a sample in it... so all those authors are Nas for the lyrics, and the rest is the producer, the musicians (if they came up with the melodies), the writers of the song sampled "It Ain't Hard To Tell", the writers of the song sampled in the sample from "It Ain't Hard To Tell" (I just checked and that song sampled "Human Nature" and "N.T") it's getting confusing a bit now lol....

so that's why there are so many songwriters

all those guys (except maybe for the producer) probably didn't have any direct influence on Nas when he wrote the lyrics, since they probably never met.... well that's just my opinion, I wasn't there so I can't tell lol...

[pawel]

ok, but I also said that there are many more songs with more songwriters on it http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_Am... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/It_Was_Written
if you scroll down a bit, you see from every song the produced, writers, samples etc....

[mart85]

yeah, well the people that get credited as writer are either writers of the sampled song, or the producer, the musicians etc... and obviously the rapper (if he writes his lyrics... )

but nobody knows if Nas (for example) wrote lyrics for one of those song alone, or with other people in studio and then someone said something that inspired Nas or whatever lol etc... it's a case-by-case thing.... but unless someone sits with Nas and comes up with lines for his verse, he won't get credited...

people who are "just checking things if they're ok, or just helping when an MC just don't know how to rhyme something 'n stuff" like you said, are usually executive producers... or random people in the studio lol

[,-,'-{Bar}-',-,]

if i i was writing and say had this line

ryhme tight coz the tight ryhme might show light

then my mate in the studio was like wait put this next

go right to the fight like khan coz a can n i plan with

thne he technically helped me write that song so his name should go in credits or he can sue

[$0 R3@L]

plus the producer helps to make sure the beat fits around your lyrics,therefore his name goes down.

Like others have said some artists also have ghost writers to help with certain lines and hooks.

Personally the day i need someone to write my raps is the day i stop but these people are gettin millions for doin it so prolly its a lil less personal for them and a lil more buisness.

[,-,'-{Bar}-',-,]

plus the producer helps to make sure the beat fits around your lyrics,therefore his name goes down.

Like others have said some artists also have ghost writers to help with certain lines and hooks.

Personally the day i need someone to write my raps is the day i stop but these people are gettin millions for doin it so prolly its a lil less personal for them and a lil more buisness.

yeh i agree, if its just your voice doin the raps well there aint a point in the person even being a rapper, they dont make the beat, they dont mix it they dont write it....thats basically 98% of the important things in a song and they didnt do any of them...