Anything put a damper on Eminem's legacy

[EminemInsider]

And you want to talk about the mainstream appeal?

Well gee...it won the Grammy for Best Rap Album. Encore didn't. It was the 8th highest selling album of the year...and he did this without even really trying for a pop hit ("We Made You" was just his quota for Interscope).

People don't buy albums anymore, anyway.

Nonetheless, even if he did flop commercially, what would it matter at this point? He's already a legend.

If Bob Dylan releases an album tomorrow and it doesn't sell, you think that puts a huge "damper on his legacy?"

Encore missed Grammy deadline if I remember correctly

So he made WMY for Interscope, does that change the fact that it was still a failed 'pop' single? hmm no
and if people don't buy albums anymore how come Wayne sold 1 mili first week just one year earlier

I didn't even say it mattered if it flopped, it's not like he cares or he shares the money with me, but it's not the point of the debate.

So what if it did? That means that if he puts out a pop single that DOES appeal more to the idiotic masses, he won't be able to regain their attention with it?

When all is said and done, nobody will remember We Made You. However, the true rap fans will remember how awful the Encore album was.

Lil Wayne's the exception to the rule. He's found a way to be so ridiculous and bizarre that people actually notice him. It was still the lowest selling album to ever top the charts.

The bottom line is album sales have been plummeting for the last decade, and only one or two people have enough mass appeal to overcome the trend.

[Alaine]

And you want to talk about the mainstream appeal?

Well gee...it won the Grammy for Best Rap Album. Encore didn't. It was the 8th highest selling album of the year...and he did this without even really trying for a pop hit ("We Made You" was just his quota for Interscope).

People don't buy albums anymore, anyway.

Nonetheless, even if he did flop commercially, what would it matter at this point? He's already a legend.

If Bob Dylan releases an album tomorrow and it doesn't sell, you think that puts a huge "damper on his legacy?"

Encore missed Grammy deadline if I remember correctly

So he made WMY for Interscope, does that change the fact that it was still a failed 'pop' single? hmm no
and if people don't buy albums anymore how come Wayne sold 1 mili first week just one year earlier

I didn't even say it mattered if it flopped, it's not like he cares or he shares the money with me, but it's not the point of the debate.

So what if it did? That means that if he puts out a pop single that DOES appeal more to the idiotic masses, he won't be able to regain their attention with it?

When all is said and done, nobody will remember We Made You. However, the true rap fans will remember how awful the Encore album was.

Lil Wayne's the exception to the rule. He's found a way to be so ridiculous and bizarre that people actually notice him. It was still the lowest selling album to ever top the charts.

The bottom line is album sales have been plummeting for the last decade, and only one or two people have enough mass appeal to overcome the trend.

actually in the past he was able to put out poppy first single but still dope at the same, WMY is just a fail in every possible way.
And of course people will still remember WMY, just like they remember Just lose it, FACK, ..

However, it's not like he can't regain his mass appeal, just one big single and he's back like he never left, that's what mainstream world like.

It was still the lowest selling album to ever top the charts.

what's that supposed to mean?

[MikeNUFC]

I wouldn't say the whole of Encore put a damper on hus legacy - just the songs that are trying to be funny and fail horribly.

I wouldnt say his haitus did either. People aint gunna remember his poor featurings (Touchdown etc) to be honest.

[EminemInsider]

actually in the past he was able to put out poppy first single but still dope at the same, WMY is just a fail in every possible way.
And of course people will still remember WMY, just like they remember Just lose it, FACK, ..

However, it's not like he can't regain his mass appeal, just one big single and he's back like he never left, that's what mainstream world like.

We Made You was nothing like Just Lose It and FACK, come on. He's got 5+ syllable multis all over the place...if he didn't have the accent, it would've been about as good as Without Me (neither of which are tracks I'm particularly fond of...but they're not complete shit).

Just Lose It was the equivalent to taking a giant shit on his entire career. It was embarrassing...and it was the first time as an Eminem fan I wanted to hide my face in shame.

Fack was a "song" that even in his pill-induced zombie state he intended as a joke...but nobody got it and it backfired and is etched in stone as rock bottom (no inappropriate pun intended).

what's that supposed to mean?

It means that while Wayne sold a lot of albums, the number he sold should not have been enough to top the charts, yet it was. It was the lowest-selling top-selling album since they started recording the data.

So the overall point remains the same: Album sales are plummeting, so Eminem will never sell like he used to. Still, very few have leapfrogged him in that department.

[Alaine]

actually in the past he was able to put out poppy first single but still dope at the same, WMY is just a fail in every possible way.
And of course people will still remember WMY, just like they remember Just lose it, FACK, ..

However, it's not like he can't regain his mass appeal, just one big single and he's back like he never left, that's what mainstream world like.

We Made You was nothing like Just Lose It and FACK, come on. He's got 5+ syllable multis all over the place...if he didn't have the accent, it would've been about as good as Without Me (neither of which are tracks I'm particularly fond of...but they're not complete shit).

Just Lose It was the equivalent to taking a giant shit on his entire career. It was embarrassing...and it was the first time as an Eminem fan I wanted to hide my face in shame.

Fack was a "song" that even in his pill-induced zombie state he intended as a joke...but nobody got it and it backfired and is etched in stone as rock bottom (no inappropriate pun intended).

what's that supposed to mean?

It means that while Wayne sold a lot of albums, the number he sold should not have been enough to top the charts, yet it was. It was the lowest-selling top-selling album since they started recording the data.

So the overall point remains the same: Album sales are plummeting, so Eminem will never sell like he used to. Still, very few have leapfrogged him in that department.

sorry but still rapping about basing celebrity after 10 years (about ppl who are not even current) + embarrassing accent = It's also not as catchy as his other first singles, at least Just Lose it was catchy, even if it's stupid.

and how can wayne's album be the lowest-selling top-selling album when it sold 1 mili first week? There were like 4-5 albums that went platinum first week before

[EminemBase]

sorry but still rapping about basing celebrity after 10 years (about ppl who are not even current) + embarrassing accent = It's also not as catchy as his other first singles, at least Just Lose it was catchy, even if it's stupid.e

What do you mean STILL. People keep acting like that's all he used to do.

On SSLP "My Name Is" is pretty the only pop-culture bashing song on the album and that was a random, fuck-around fluke. After that he tailored his 1st singles on that but 99% of the rest of the albums have fuck all to do with that.

That's not his aim, it's just part of his 1st single shtick. People act like this also by saying all he talks about is Kim, Hailie etc. When out of about... 400 released tracks, you actually only have like... 3 which are about his mother and a few about Kim and Hailie.

Not even close to a majority share. The amount of topics he covers line to line, song to song, is immense. You couldn't say all he raps about is X anything. He's a grasshopper of subjects.

And just because YOU think the 'accent' is embarressing doesn't make it so. WMY is 100 times better than Just Lose It. Childish screaming and dance beats are embarressing. Serial killing, razor sharp flows and word-bending is badass.

[Emadyville]

^ I've thought about the accent, and my opinion is that he does it to fit the beat. As in he makes the accents when he thinks his regular voice doesn't sound right on the beat/an accent sounds best over the beat. I think that may be why, not just cause he likes do it. Also, it could simply be him trying to sound different from track to track...Just my thoughts on why he does it, cause sometimes it sucks but a lot of times its works

[Alaine]

sorry but still rapping about basing celebrity after 10 years (about ppl who are not even current) + embarrassing accent = It's also not as catchy as his other first singles, at least Just Lose it was catchy, even if it's stupid.e

What do you mean STILL. People keep acting like that's all he used to do.

On SSLP "My Name Is" is pretty the only pop-culture bashing song on the album and that was a random, fuck-around fluke. After that he tailored his 1st singles on that but 99% of the rest of the albums have fuck all to do with that.

That's not his aim, it's just part of his 1st single shtick. People act like this also by saying all he talks about is Kim, Hailie etc. When out of about... 400 released tracks, you actually only have like... 3 which are about his mother and a few about Kim and Hailie.

Not even close to a majority share. The amount of topics he covers line to line, song to song, is immense. You couldn't say all he raps about is X anything. He's a grasshopper of subjects.

And just because YOU think the 'accent' is embarressing doesn't make it so. WMY is 100 times better than Just Lose It. Childish screaming and dance beats are embarressing. Serial killing, razor sharp flows and word-bending is badass.

I'm talking about WMY here, not the whole Relapse, the accent in WMY is embarrasing, it made an already corny song even cornier Just Lose it is real bad, but WMY is not much better imo, go on and bring *but it has crazy multi* and stuff, at the end of the day it's still music, and if it's not enjoyable to listen to, it's still not good.

you count him has 400 tracks because we are hardcore fans that follow his every features and stuff, but ppl outside only know about his official albums, and *coincidentally* all those tracks about bashing celebrities happen to be the most famous, that why he left the mark as 'celebrity basher' in a lot of ppl mind. I don't think he even rap about his mom or Kim or Haillie that much but they just happen to be the highlights of his albums, that's why ppl tend to remember those songs.

[Fa-Q]

Hmmm I think Alaine is right

[EminemBase]

I'm talking about WMY here, not the whole Relapse, the accent in WMY is embarrasing, it made an already corny song even cornier Just Lose it is real bad, but WMY is not much better imo, go on and bring *but it has crazy multi* and stuff, at the end of the day it's still music, and if it's not enjoyable to listen to, it's still not good.

Yeah and I believe I just talked about WMY too. It's not an accent on WMY, it's a flow. It's a spitfire flow, the accent is American. And it's not embarrassing to me.

It's also not corny due to his use of more mature phrasing such as:
"Forget them other men girl, pay them little attention and little did I mention"

Like all of Relapse, his style has evolved to phrasing which is more mature and poetic. Go ahead and point out a few zany / silly lines but I'm talking about fundamental phrasing.

"And little did I mention". It's like old-English dialect, there's something more sophisticated about it than cheesy rapper slang. It's also not corny to me because of the dark element. He's not bashing on celebrities, he's killing them.

"The enforcer, looking for more woman to torture"

Something with a dark streak like that fails to be corny to me regardless of how zany and upbeat it may sound on face-value. And it's also very good to listen to, to me. I don't give a fuck what he's talking about, only how he talks about it, how well it's executed and how good it sounds.

And Relapse sounds pretty fucking awesome to my ears.

you count him has 400 tracks because we are hardcore fans that follow his every features and stuff, but ppl outside only know about his official albums, and *coincidentally* all those tracks about bashing celebrities happen to be the most famous, that why he left the mark as 'celebrity basher' in a lot of ppl mind.

Yeah and even on just his 'official albums' the tracks about celebrities, his mother and Hailie don't even come close to holding the majority share. It'd be more accurate to say all he does is talk about killing people. He covers an absolutely mind-blowing spectrum of ideas and topics. He's not one anything.

Those 'celeb-bashing' tracks are only the most famous because they're his lead singles. But they're not his most famous to his proper fans. People who buy his albums for the tracks and not the singles. Those singles are throwaway tracks, they're just introductions to the albums, nothing more.

They're also not celeb-bashing tracks either.

"My Name Is" - The only pop icons he mentions in relation to 'bashing' are the Spice Girls and Pamela Lee. So out of of three verses and a chorus you get two names. It's hardly the driving force of the song isit. He's introducing himself, people just remember the pop icon shit as if it's the driving force, they were random passing names in the song not the aim or the main content AT ALL.

"The Real Slim Shady" - Again, he mentions a handful of pop figures, some of which for a reason such as Christina - Who was talking about his personal shit on live TV. This song is about the Slim Shady persona and the culture at large, not about pop icons. With the amount of shit he covers line to line, he's obviously going to naturally rattle off names in association but it's not the main objective.

"Without Me" - Again, a handful of people but this time again usually for a reason, such as insulting Moby in response to Moby talking shit about him. Main track objective is to re-inforce his re-entry, re-instate his controversial views and act zany.

"Just Lose It" is pretty much the only track you could say is a true celeb-bashing track because at this point, he lost sight of why he was doing it and just duplicated the celebrity-name-inclusion aspect for effect because he knew it was always successful.

Then "We Made You" he's killing female celebrities not bashing random pop icons, killing females in overly-descriptive fashions as the rap-serial-killing saviour on a missing is the premise of the entire album not the gimmick of this one track.

So to say he's a celeb-basher or that's all he does etc. Is ridiculous. It doesn't even come close to defining his music, any of it, at large. Not even the tracks people relate to that theme.

I don't think he even rap about his mom or Kim or Haillie that much but they just happen to be the highlights of his albums, that's why ppl tend to remember those songs.

Yes that's my point about people just remembering the stand-out tracks about Hailie, his mother and Kim but that doesn't mean it's correct. He has a handful of tracks about all of them combined. It's not a true statement about what he does. Saying he bitches about fame would be much more accurate than that.

People just have stupid, selective memories to re-inforce their bullshit unfounded views.

[Knight-ofthe-Pen]

why should anything put a damper on Eminem's legacy? he's a legend, isn't he?

but does someone notice you're always talking about the same?
just how shit Encore was and how bad Relapse is now and how shit you think Fack/etc is (I love this song ) and that the mainstream-fans don't know nothing about him as a rapper and hardcore-rap fans always will think how mainstream he became

are you ready with bitching? Em's one of the greatest musician we have nowadays and that's what he will be known for in history - and that's what he should be known for
and not how awkward his fans think some accent-playing is or how they stuck in complaining about some serial-killer images he raps about or something you just said here and in other threads

I have an advice for you: if you don't like a song, don't listen to and if you're not ok with what Eminem puts on this LP, stop listen to it and if you don't like the way he's going right now, stop being a current fan

[Alaine]

I'm talking about WMY here, not the whole Relapse, the accent in WMY is embarrasing, it made an already corny song even cornier Just Lose it is real bad, but WMY is not much better imo, go on and bring *but it has crazy multi* and stuff, at the end of the day it's still music, and if it's not enjoyable to listen to, it's still not good.

Yeah and I believe I just talked about WMY too. It's not an accent on WMY, it's a flow. It's a spitfire flow, the accent is American. And it's not embarrassing to me.

It's also not corny due to his use of more mature phrasing such as:
"Forget them other men girl, pay them little attention and little did I mention"

Like all of Relapse, his style has evolved to phrasing which is more mature and poetic. Go ahead and point out a few zany / silly lines but I'm talking about fundamental phrasing.

"And little did I mention". It's like old-English dialect, there's something more sophisticated about it than cheesy rapper slang. It's also not corny to me because of the dark element. He's not bashing on celebrities, he's killing them.

"The enforcer, looking for more woman to torture"

Something with a dark streak like that fails to be corny to me regardless of how zany and upbeat it may sound on face-value. And it's also very good to listen to, to me. I don't give a fuck what he's talking about, only how he talks about it, how well it's executed and how good it sounds.

And Relapse sounds pretty fucking awesome to my ears.

you count him has 400 tracks because we are hardcore fans that follow his every features and stuff, but ppl outside only know about his official albums, and *coincidentally* all those tracks about bashing celebrities happen to be the most famous, that why he left the mark as 'celebrity basher' in a lot of ppl mind.

Yeah and even on just his 'official albums' the tracks about celebrities, his mother and Hailie don't even come close to holding the majority share. It'd be more accurate to say all he does is talk about killing people. He covers an absolutely mind-blowing spectrum of ideas and topics. He's not one anything.

Those 'celeb-bashing' tracks are only the most famous because they're his lead singles. But they're not his most famous to his proper fans. People who buy his albums for the tracks and not the singles. Those singles are throwaway tracks, they're just introductions to the albums, nothing more.

They're also not celeb-bashing tracks either.

"My Name Is" - The only pop icons he mentions in relation to 'bashing' are the Spice Girls and Pamela Lee. So out of of three verses and a chorus you get two names. It's hardly the driving force of the song isit. He's introducing himself, people just remember the pop icon shit as if it's the driving force, they were random passing names in the song not the aim or the main content AT ALL.

"The Real Slim Shady" - Again, he mentions a handful of pop figures, some of which for a reason such as Christina - Who was talking about his personal shit on live TV. This song is about the Slim Shady persona and the culture at large, not about pop icons. With the amount of shit he covers line to line, he's obviously going to naturally rattle off names in association but it's not the main objective.

"Without Me" - Again, a handful of people but this time again usually for a reason, such as insulting Moby in response to Moby talking shit about him. Main track objective is to re-inforce his re-entry, re-instate his controversial views and act zany.

"Just Lose It" is pretty much the only track you could say is a true celeb-bashing track because at this point, he lost sight of why he was doing it and just duplicated the celebrity-name-inclusion aspect for effect because he knew it was always successful.

Then "We Made You" he's killing female celebrities not bashing random pop icons, killing females in overly-descriptive fashions as the rap-serial-killing saviour on a missing is the premise of the entire album not the gimmick of this one track.

So to say he's a celeb-basher or that's all he does etc. Is ridiculous. It doesn't even come close to defining his music, any of it, at large. Not even the tracks people relate to that theme.

I don't think he even rap about his mom or Kim or Haillie that much but they just happen to be the highlights of his albums, that's why ppl tend to remember those songs.

Yes that's my point about people just remembering the stand-out tracks about Hailie, his mother and Kim but that doesn't mean it's correct. He has a handful of tracks about all of them combined. It's not a true statement about what he does. Saying he bitches about fame would be much more accurate than that.

People just have stupid, selective memories to re-inforce their bullshit unfounded views.

I think you could make it short that that we both have to agree to disagree on WMY, since to you ears it sounds good and to my ears it sounds like rubbish Other than that we have no debate really .

[GoodGirlsGetGutted]

i guess this thread is asking for the embarrassing things eminem has done? let's compile a list:

- Encore
- Get in a fight with a dog puppet
- Make a racist tape when 16
- Cry a bit about being famous (Encore/Eminem Show)
- Encore
- 2005 (Curtain Call & touring), 2006 (Reup, Akon?! Akon?!?!), 2007
- Encore

You forgot Bruno's nut sack.

[AliJack]

It put a damper on his legacy wether you like it or not. People expect the eminem we know to kick the shit out of bruno and it turns out he wanted that to happen? hell nah