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Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

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Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby katha » Sep 20th, '10, 11:35

I know this has been discussed already, but some of the reactions towards not only Eminem, but hip hop in general and also towards bands, singers coming from a lower class always bother me. There's this presumption that someone isn't smart because they don't have loads of diplomas, are "white trash", "ghetto", whatever, and it drives me absolutely batty. It's classism in its purest form. It's much harder to finish school when you don't come from a stable environment, when your parents aren't supportive, when you don't have money, when you're being bullied etc.

I'm currently at university and there are many conversations here about parents financing appartments, sponsoring some time abroad and so on. Of course not everybody is swimming in luxuries, many of us need to work, but there is clearly financial and emotional support from home in most cases. My parents help me and make it possible for me to have this education, it becomes much harder to do these things if you're mostly on your own.

Eminem is very, very smart. How can you listen to SSLP, MMLP, and TES and think otherwise? Quite a bit of stuff from Relapse and Recovery qualifies as well. He nails the hipocrisy of the media, politics and organized religion. He explains the problems that come with fame. He paints an accurate picture of the dynamics of domestic violence. He analyzes his own addiction in funny and insightful ways and takes responsibility for his fuck-ups. He acknowledges his privilege as a white rapper. And he does all of that while rhyming well (for the most part :whistle: ). But it seems to me that many in the media have difficulty giving props for that because they're often themselves college-educated blowhards who can't see past the "trailer trash" bit when it comes to Eminem. Or past "ghetto" "scary black man" etc. when it comes to rap in general.

So I think that Eminem often doesn't get his due from critics because of his genre (that's often linked to a "trashy" lifestyle) and because of his lower class roots. Hence this compulsive need to take everything he says in his songs literally and not bother with interpretation. Do you think this plays a role in public perception or am I just running amok because I've read too many fancy sociology essays in my time? :shifty:
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Devil'sAdvocate » Sep 20th, '10, 12:54

no

rap actualy is settin records more than other music
The devil ain't on a level same as him!
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby MikeNUFC » Sep 20th, '10, 18:09

Rap as a genre doesnt get the recognition it deserves - there's so many underlying racist and class-ist tones in the criticism of the genre - hugely misinterpreted. There's this "thuggish" image that the media paint of the genre based on very few artists. It's ridiculous

It's very rare that you'd see a working class artist be labelled a "genius" - 90% of artists labelled that are middle-upper class.
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby MikeNUFC » Sep 20th, '10, 18:29

Killa wrote:Someone wanna summarise for me cos thread title sounds retarded.

Media and the upper class have class prejudices

Eminem not getting recognition for his genius by these sections becuase he's working class, which is true in some respects.

Goes for a lot of rap.
Last edited by MikeNUFC on Sep 20th, '10, 18:30, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Alaine » Sep 20th, '10, 18:30

yeah people keep calling him white trash even though he's been all nice lately :angry:

and lots of people discredit 'rap' in general, they always say "That's not even music".."Rap is crap"...
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Hiphopdane » Sep 20th, '10, 18:32

Hip hop as a genre will never get the respect it deserves as long as the labels are dictating what good music is. Some time ago I read an interview with Raekwon where he said that labels are paying american radio stations to play their music. How do lesser known (but even more talented) artists stand a chance when it's all about who has the most money?

It's very easy to see why so many people think hip hop listeners arent "music fans" when you have Rick Ross selling 130k first week by having singles about cars and bitches ("Aston Martin music" wtf?).

In Eminem's case, I can't see the problem. The guy has had numerous no. 1 singles and is probably the only rap artist that I have even seen been compared to legendary poets. The 8 Mile movie also helped him alot by changing his image from an immarture child to a hard working family man.
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby watevermannnn » Sep 20th, '10, 18:42

best rap album of 2009 wasn't even shown on tv for the grammys.

My friends teacher allows kids to listen to their iPods, as long its not that "rap crap". AHAHAH.




I mean, what is rap anyway? Retards Attempting Poetry, right? AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH :facepalm
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Alaine » Sep 20th, '10, 19:06

thing is, most raps on radio are about pointless things, they're just catchy. If people had a chance to listen to more meaningful, lyrical rap, I'm sure they'd appreciate it, but they just don't have a chance. Why can't lyrical rappers make their tracks more catchy & relateable? it can't be that hard
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby MikeNUFC » Sep 20th, '10, 19:12

Alaine wrote:thing is, most raps on radio are about pointless things, they're just catchy. If people had a chance to listen to more meaningful, lyrical rap, I'm sure they'd appreciate it, but they just don't have a chance. Why can't lyrical rappers make their tracks more catchy & relateable? it can't be that hard

Why should rappers have to make their songs catchy just to please fucking idiotic kids who cant listen to anything unless its got some R'n'B singer in the hook?

Of course they have a chance - with the internet you can get anything you want in seconds. It's just that this generation has got used to music that has no meaning or talent at all.

Listen to a Masta Ace album from 2001-onwards - his songs are catchy as fuck, yet still being meaningful and rhyming well. But record labels and the consumers dont want meaningful - they want sugar coated bullshit that sells well.

The mainstream is full of stupid fucking idiots who play shitty Sean Kingston songs out of their phones these days and won't listen to anything that's not exactly like that.
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Mikey1990 » Sep 20th, '10, 19:26

Why should rappers have to make their songs catchy just to please fucking idiotic kids who cant listen to anything unless its got some R'n'B singer in the hook?

Of course they have a chance - with the internet you can get anything you want in seconds. It's just that this generation has got used to music that has no meaning or talent at all.

Listen to a Masta Ace album from 2001-onwards - his songs are catchy as fuck, yet still being meaningful and rhyming well. But record labels and the consumers dont want meaningful - they want sugar coated bullshit that sells well.

The mainstream is full of stupid fucking idiots who play shitty Sean Kingston songs out of their phones these days and won't listen to anything that's not exactly like that
.
i wouldnt blame kids ..
its the radio's who are to blame
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Alaine » Sep 20th, '10, 19:29

^ well I'm not saying they have to make the whole albums full of poppy tracks or something, but 1 song for a single can't be harmed. Like Eminem would never got to the place he is if not for My name is, real slim shady.. millions people bought his album for the single and then they got introduced to the brilliance of the albums. I believe when some rappers say they don't care about sale, but I'm sure they would love to share their music to many ppl as possible.

and radio is not all to blame, radio play tracks on request
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby GenePeer » Sep 20th, '10, 22:08

Alaine wrote:thing is, most raps on radio are about pointless things, they're just catchy.

There's more to it than just "catchiness". How the fuck does "Pretty Boy Swag", which is horrible in all aspects of music i can think of, manage to be #5 on U.S. Rap Songs. Baffling I tell you.

Rap is also a good example of people feeding their stereotypes. You can't make people like Soulja Boy and New Boyz (and all those who get famous for "rap" songs about dance moves) famous, and expect people to take the genre seriously. anyway, my only consolation is no genre really gets the recognition we wish for rap. I've never heard anyone call Mariah Carey or Coldplay geniuses :coffee:
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby Jay-Hova » Sep 20th, '10, 22:19

MikeNUFC wrote:Rap as a genre doesnt get the recognition it deserves - there's so many underlying racist and class-ist tones in the criticism of the genre - hugely misinterpreted. There's this "thuggish" image that the media paint of the genre based on very few artists. It's ridiculous

It's very rare that you'd see a working class artist be labelled a "genius" - 90% of artists labelled that are middle-upper class.

This is the truest statement ever.

Ok, let me contribute to this thread by giving an example of myself. Ok, I get really pissed off when I try to explain myself to other people what I do (write rap music). And I'm not black so they're like "what the fuck are you doing writing that type of music", in other words Hip-Hop music is bad or negative. Or I get the "oh is it that hardcore gangsta yo! yo! music"? Or...yeah you get the point. So basically Hip-Hop is only for thugs born in the projects that constantly say yo! yo! whut up dawg. And Eminem is a wannabe and sucks for being white and rapping.

I could write a whole page about it. And it really irriatates me and makes me wanna cuss them the fuck out for being close-minded and stupid.

Sometimes I really wish people in the real world were as smart as some of our members here in TRshady :b:
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Re: Eminem not getting recognition because of his background?

Postby katha » Sep 21st, '10, 08:39

jpmutanguha2009 wrote:
Alaine wrote:thing is, most raps on radio are about pointless things, they're just catchy.

There's more to it than just "catchiness". How the fuck does "Pretty Boy Swag", which is horrible in all aspects of music i can think of, manage to be #5 on U.S. Rap Songs. Baffling I tell you.

Rap is also a good example of people feeding their stereotypes. You can't make people like Soulja Boy and New Boyz (and all those who get famous for "rap" songs about dance moves) famous, and expect people to take the genre seriously. anyway, my only consolation is no genre really gets the recognition we wish for rap. I've never heard anyone call Mariah Carey or Coldplay geniuses :coffee:


Well, Coldplay do make "Best Artists", "Best Album" lists regularly, so I'm not so sure about that... OTOH they get ridiculed for their whininess, that's true. :8) With Carey, I think, you're already in murkier water. No, she's not proclaimed a genius. Alicia Keys is sometimes, though. IMO because she markets herself as "serious songwriter". I think this stuff goes on in pop as well, Gaga is a genius while Aguilera is declared a trashy copycat even though she's been around a decade or so longer.

And yeah, mainstream rap does feed into its own stereotypes sometimes. But then it becomes this chicken and egg question, doesn't it? Do they feed into the stereotypes because that's the only thing radio wants to play? The other way around? And why is the whole genre dismissed because of Soulja Boy while Nickelback are seen as just one of many rock bands and not as a representative?
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