EminemBase's Weekly Round-Up - #1

[EminemBase]

Seduction is easily mainstream...so is No Love...so is So Bad
i'm not gonna mention others because you can argue about them...but these are obvious
typical mainstream topics of bragging, knocking haters, and boasting about your dick game

Firstly, those could only be argued as mainstream rap themes.

Secondly, it's all about the execution of something - And Eminem's execution is still very particular, unique, uncompromised and not mainstream. Mainstream if it's to be defined as anything is watered down. His execution is anything but that.

Thirdly, Eminem has always rapped about those things in various ways (Stick figure with a dick bigger than Mark Wahlberg) the only difference is, he's now doing it in a more casual way. Partially to sound different (from his past styles) and partially to try and make himself of this era.

But he's not mainstream in his execution. And "So Bad" is certainly not mainstream.

"I was bound to work a number on your back and throw your spine out of alignment"

He's totally himself in every aspect.

[Emadyville]

Well if your classification of mainstream is his mentioning popular names he's been 'mainstream' since day one...

No, I agree, I brought it up to see what your opinion was, and even if using popular names, shows, movies, or whatever that is well know and "popular", I think it couldn't be considered mainstream because the vast majority of rappers underground, signed, or whatever use that stuff. Just something I thought would be interesting to bring up.

The one problem I have, and this sorta goes with Sox's post (tho I'll have to make assumptions, so correct if I'm wrong in those), is that song's like "No Love" I think you'd say would be mainstream because it features Wayne (correct me if I'm wrong), and the easy example ppl have mentioned would be LTWYL because it features Rhianna. The problem I have with people saying this is mainstream (while it obviously is because of it's popularity, chart success, sales...but NOT due to Em still being 100% em on the track) is that they say it is because it features rhianna.

With this example, and the no love example if I was correct in assuming what sox was implying, why is it that he cannot feature these artists on a song? It's saying that he can make music, but he can't feature someone considered "mainstream" or "popular" even if he wants to for what could be a plethora of reasons, and if he does he is therefore making a "mainstream" song and/or is selling out?

I don't know, the fact that saying he only got rhianna cause she's popular, and not because she "was the only one who could pull it off" (to quote eminem), or because he likes her music, or just because he wants to work with her, to me just doesn't make sense. I cannot deem this a viable reason, unless obviously if he were to say he did it because he knew it would sell or this or that. Just my thoughts on that, it always kind of bothered me, and mostly due to the reaction to LTWYL.

[GenePeer]

The songs I'd say to be "mainstream" are 25 To Life, Love The Way You Lie, Not Afraid, Space Bound, Talking 2 Myself (and maybe GTC too?). Anyway, it's not like I care about it though. Mainstream or not, I just want a good album, which is what I got.

On this weekly round-ups, great read I'm just curious; if you wrote all that on just two things, what happens when there's like 6 things? We all get an iGarsm? lol. At least I now have a reason to check the Eminem section again.

edit: EmBase, since you're obsessed with details, I thought I'd let you know. You italicized Lauren Hill's name instead of her Album's

[Rash J]

Great job man. Enjoyed it
I think Recovery has a higher chance of getting Rap Album than AOTY. I can't see BP3 getting Rap Album if Recovery is gonna take AOTY. Like, how can you win the main award without getting the subsidiary one?

[xxTrigger1989xx]

The songs I'd say to be "mainstream" are 25 To Life, Love The Way You Lie, Not Afraid, Space Bound, Talking 2 Myself (and maybe GTC too?). Anyway, it's not like I care about it though. Mainstream or not, I just want a good album, which is what I got.

On this weekly round-ups, great read I'm just curious; if you wrote all that on just two things, what happens when there's like 6 things? We all get an iGarsm? lol. At least I now have a reason to check the Eminem section again.

edit: EmBase, since you're obsessed with details, I thought I'd let you know. You italicized Lauren Hill's name instead of her Album's

25 To Life is not mainstream. It might SOUND that way because it has a female on the chorus, but that doesn't make a song mainstream. If it was mainstream, it'd be getting radio play right now. The beat isn't mainstream, I've never heard a beat like that before, it's not glittered with all the other bullshit that pop rap beats come with. His lyrics aren't mainstream, he cusses a lot, whereas in LTWYL, he doesn't cuss that much. He says "fuck you, hip hop", what mainstream song would say that?

Space Bound is kind of mainstream-sounding, it was obvious the ladies are supposed to love this one too, but it's really not THAT mainstream. Not Afraid is mainstream, as is LTWYL. T2M has a mainstream sound to it, kind of

A LOT of Em's music sounds mainstream. But, it's the good mainstream. Em has been mainstream since SSLP when he blew up

[EminemBase]

Nothing about his lyricism is mainstream.

Then what do you call those dumb punch lines that EVERYONE else in the mainstream uses?

Right, because punchlines were invented by the mainstream?

What's important is the execution. Punchlines themselves aren't mainstream. He's just trying to update his sound, but it's still totally him.

A feedline / punchline structure isn't new or mainstream. If you'll notice he was doing those on Infinite. His execution is still absolutely him. That's like saying Kanye's mainstream for using auto-tune, it's all about how you use it, nothing about Kanye's use of it is mainstream.

It's just the other cocks who copy him who are. They're watered down. He's trying to be unique and single-visioned always though, like Em is.

Punchlines have always been a part rap, it's just another tool in the arsenal - And, he hasn't used them in this way hardly at all on past albums so it's just another way to separate his new style(s).

Eminem is still rapping about the things he was rapping about 10 fucking years ago. He's always going to keep trying to change or evolve his style but rapping about raping / beating women, how lyrical and cerebral you are and fucking the world is in no way mainstream. Just because rap is a mainstream genre now, to say "fuck the world" on a record is still not mainstream in comparison to other music.

It's still uncensored, Eminem is still totally uncensored, raw and committed to being himself. He has not and never has compromised his integrity or artistry for anything less than that.

He's quite obviously, desperately trying to be as good as he was 10 years ago whilst still sounding new, anybody who can't hear that is listening to different music to me...

"I'LL BE SCREAMING ON THESE WHORES TILL I'M HOARSE"

Whether or not you think the use of punchlines are corny is one thing but he's absolutely begging you to hate him, trying desperately to revive that subversive / anti-world wit that he always had. And that is in no way mainstream, he's doing nothing but trying to be himself.

[Devil'sAdvocate]

this was a very good read,agree with all the points.

[GenePeer]

25 To Life is not mainstream. It might SOUND that way because it has a female on the chorus, but that doesn't make a song mainstream.

So what actually does? I agree on the lyrics point, but lyrics only won't make me strike it out completely.

If it was mainstream, it'd be getting radio play right now.

Maybe if it were released as a single? Honestly, I haven't heard anything other than his singles on radio. Plus they'd release Space Bound/T2M before that, so never gonna happen. Remember, pop artists have completely mainstream albums but you don't hear every song on it on the radio, do you?

The beat isn't mainstream, I've never heard a beat like that before, it's not glittered with all the other bullshit that pop rap beats come with.

There's a first time for everything, even "mainstream beats".

Space Bound is kind of mainstream-sounding, it was obvious the ladies are supposed to love this one too, but it's really not THAT mainstream. Not Afraid is mainstream, as is LTWYL. T2M has a mainstream sound to it, kind of

T2M is mainstream to the core. I could have sworn it was made to be a single before the success of LTWYL took them by surprise. And what do you mean Space Bound isn't THAT mainstream? What's not mainstream about it? It's almost identical to LTWYL, how can you call one mainstream and the other not THAT mainstream?

No comment of the last bit since I already said I don't care whether he's mainstream or not. I just want good music.

[xxTrigger1989xx]

Space Bound is kind of mainstream-sounding, it was obvious the ladies are supposed to love this one too, but it's really not THAT mainstream. Not Afraid is mainstream, as is LTWYL. T2M has a mainstream sound to it, kind of

T2M is mainstream to the core. I could have sworn it was made to be a single before the success of LTWYL took them by surprise. And what do you mean Space Bound isn't THAT mainstream? What's not mainstream about it? It's almost identical to LTWYL, how can you call one mainstream and the other not THAT mainstream?

No comment of the last bit since I already said I don't care whether he's mainstream or not. I just want good music.

I mean that Space Bound has a clear target audience, it sounds mainstream-ish, but overall I don't think it's really THAT mainstream to be honest. I hear plenty of differences between SB and LTWYL. You might hear it differently than I do

[EminemBase]

Space Bound is kind of mainstream-sounding, it was obvious the ladies are supposed to love this one too, but it's really not THAT mainstream. Not Afraid is mainstream, as is LTWYL. T2M has a mainstream sound to it, kind of

T2M is mainstream to the core. I could have sworn it was made to be a single before the success of LTWYL took them by surprise. And what do you mean Space Bound isn't THAT mainstream? What's not mainstream about it? It's almost identical to LTWYL, how can you call one mainstream and the other not THAT mainstream?

No comment of the last bit since I already said I don't care whether he's mainstream or not. I just want good music.

I mean that Space Bound has a clear target audience, it sounds mainstream-ish, but overall I don't think it's really THAT mainstream to be honest. I hear plenty of differences between SB and LTWYL. You might hear it differently than I do

"Space Bound" is not mainstream at all.

People have no fucking idea what their own definition of that word even boils down to.

They think if it's catchy it's mainstream. So what, if it doesn't sound shit it's mainstream? lmfao. Good music doesn't = mainstream, catchy music doesn't = mainstream.

His execution and content is still totally unique to him.

Strangling a women with his bare-hands and then blowing his brains out? Yeah, how incredibly mainstream. You hear that on radio every day don't you.

Blood-suckin' succubuses, what the fuck is up with this?

= Nooooooot mainstream. It's just because he's incredibly melodic and rhythmic and makes catchy music no matter what his content is. That doesn't make it mainstream though, that makes it good.

[DanWS]

EmBase, you fancy writing my 8000 word dissertation for me? Would prolly only take you like, 30seconds.

Lol all jokes aside, nice article.

"in Em's case I think it's nearly always justified when you look at his content and execution. "

Well this is a little of the biasm you spoke about yourself. To some rap fans the Teflon Don was a much better album, and to others even the shitty Drake album was better. To some fans Em's content wasn't particularly great and to some fans Em got "bodied" by Lil Wayne on 'No Love'. There will always, always be biasm when it comes to music because it is totally subjective. So its your opinion when you say it's "nearly always justified".

But yea, nice article. Lookin forward to next week's round-up.

[GenePeer]

"Space Bound" is not mainstream at all.

People have no fucking idea what their own definition of that word even boils down to.

They think if it's catchy it's mainstream. So what, if it doesn't sound shit it's mainstream? lmfao. Good music doesn't = mainstream, catchy music doesn't = mainstream.

His execution and content is still totally unique to him.

Strangling a women with his bare-hands and then blowing his brains out? Yeah, how incredibly mainstream. You hear that on radio every day don't you.

Blood-suckin' succubuses, what the fuck is up with this?

= Nooooooot mainstream. It's just because he's incredibly melodic and rhythmic and makes catchy music no matter what his content is. That doesn't make it mainstream though, that makes it good.

So what's mainstream if it's not catchy? I just want to know.

LTWYL also has tying someone to the bed and setting it on fire. Why do people consider it to be mainstream? Because it was #1 on billboard?

[EminemBase]

"in Em's case I think it's nearly always justified when you look at his content and execution. "

Well this is a little of the biasm you spoke about yourself. To some rap fans the Teflon Don was a much better album, and to others even the shitty Drake album was better. To some fans Em's content wasn't particularly great and to some fans Em got "bodied" by Lil Wayne on 'No Love'.

I mean that h is content and execution are nearly always justified in respects to global recognition, in comparison to most others not just that 'the music is better'.

For example, a song about domestic violence, done in a harrowing / realistic manner just 'is' braver and more commendable of an artist than is a record about drug-dealing or picking up women which has been done 100 times before.

It's not just preference, there are reasoning points, from an intellectual stand-point to go down.

There will always, always be biasm when it comes to music because it is totally subjective. So its your opinion when you say it's "nearly always justified".

First off, it's moot to say "it's subjective". We all know an opinion is one standpoint / viewpoint heavily relying on personal taste, it doesn't need to be emphasized in every conversation.

But it's also a cop-out as, whilst opinion is based on taste - There are OBJECTIVE reasoning points behind all taste such as: universal agreement in aesthetics and sound. It's not a coincidence the majority in the know think Mozart / classical music is mind-blowing.

It's not a coincidence that almost anybody who's seen it thinks The Godfather is one of the greatest films ever made, irrespective of whether they like gangster movies or not.

It's a really weak escape-route to just say "it's all subjective". It's not ALL subjective. You can't tell somebody their opinion is wrong as a fact but you can certainly debate why you think X is more tasteful than Y or why said thing is funnier than Z. And you can back up taste with logic as, as 'subjective' as taste is, it's all rooted in logic and reasoning of some kind.

[EminemBase]

"Space Bound" is not mainstream at all.

People have no fucking idea what their own definition of that word even boils down to.

They think if it's catchy it's mainstream. So what, if it doesn't sound shit it's mainstream? lmfao. Good music doesn't = mainstream, catchy music doesn't = mainstream.

His execution and content is still totally unique to him.

Strangling a women with his bare-hands and then blowing his brains out? Yeah, how incredibly mainstream. You hear that on radio every day don't you.

Blood-suckin' succubuses, what the fuck is up with this?

= Nooooooot mainstream. It's just because he's incredibly melodic and rhythmic and makes catchy music no matter what his content is. That doesn't make it mainstream though, that makes it good.

So what's mainstream if it's not catchy? I just want to know.

LTWYL also has tying someone to the bed and setting it on fire. Why do people consider it to be mainstream? Because it was #1 on billboard?

Mainstream, in the way people here are using it = watered down / compromised.

If something happens to become a hit or happens to be popular that doesn't make it pop or mainstream by itself, that's absurd.

Tarantino is also one of the most popular film-makers but would you say Inlgourious Basterds is watered down or made for mass consumption? Of course not. It's incredibly nuanced and unique and it's a single-vision created by a true artist.

Just as is Eminem's music. It's just that they know / want to ALSO connect with people as what's the fun of making incredible work if nobody ever hears / sees it?

There's a huge difference between getting a no.1 and aiming for a no.1

A realistic song about domestic violence whereby the narrator (Eminem) is questioning himself, contradicting himself and taking you through his real-time thoughts is in no way mainstream, or compromised or made for mass-consumption.

It's very particular, it's intelligent and it's not easy to swallow.

He makes catchy music because he's a good musician and doesn't make... bad music. Simple as that. But something 'being a hit' doesn't make it mainstream. It's mainstream by association but not in its intent. None of Eminem's music is mainstream by intent, or compromised. It's 100% hip-hop and integral.

[ajthongbam]

All this talk about mainstream and nonmainstream music is bullshit. I dont get how everyone makes mainstream out to be absolutely negative. Listen to the beatles sgt. peppers lonely heart club(mainstream) and its one of the best selling album of all time. Just coz a lot of people like st doesnt mean its commercial. Mainstream music can be non commercial and great.