Eminem vs Immortal Technique?

[whiteamerica]

maybe you have heard more than me.... i've heard enough though that i don't consider eminem the GOAT anymore. i did at one point, before i discovered that underground rap is full of lyricists over sellouts

Eminem isn't a sellout. He hasn't dumbed down his lyrics or anything, he just had an extremely successful album. If you don't like the beats, that's fine, but the beats don't make someone a sell out, it's the lyrics. Eminem didn't "sell out"

what do you call someone who went from too hardcore to have shit on the radio to collaborations with ****RIHANNA****, ********WAYNE*****, ******DRAKE********.... am i missing any other radio superstars... oh wait ******NICKI MINAJ******...anymore?

[whiteamerica]

maybe you have heard more than me.... i've heard enough though that i don't consider eminem the GOAT anymore. i did at one point, before i discovered that underground rap is full of lyricists over sellouts

Are you implying Mainstream doesn't have good rappers or lyricists?

not entirely since i haven't delved into many mainstream rappers' music, although the overall quality of underground hiphop is MILES, if not LIGHTYEARS ahead of mainstream. i still believe eminem is a decent lyricist, just nothing like he was, and nothing like he could be

[xxTrigger1989xx]

maybe you have heard more than me.... i've heard enough though that i don't consider eminem the GOAT anymore. i did at one point, before i discovered that underground rap is full of lyricists over sellouts

Eminem isn't a sellout. He hasn't dumbed down his lyrics or anything, he just had an extremely successful album. If you don't like the beats, that's fine, but the beats don't make someone a sell out, it's the lyrics. Eminem didn't "sell out"

what do you call someone who went from too hardcore to have shit on the radio to collaborations with ****RIHANNA****, ********WAYNE*****, ******DRAKE********.... am i missing any other radio superstars... oh wait ******NICKI MINAJ******...anymore?

Collaborations DON'T MAKE SOMEONE A SELL OUT at all. Every other rapper in the world has collaborated with Rihanna or Wayne sometime (not the actual truth, but you get my meaning), so are they all sell outs too? Fuck no. You shouldn't judge songs by who's on them, you should judge the song by THE ACTUAL SONG. If Eminem wrote his best verse ever, and if it was on a Drake song, I wouldn't hate the song because Drake is on it too. That's stupid and closed minded. I don't see Lil Wayne's name and go "this is gonna be trash". I listen to it with an open mind, and if I like it I like it, if I don't, I don't. And I usually DON'T like his songs

[classthe_king]

Eminem sold out. You can see it in his lyrics.

[whiteamerica]

Collaborations DON'T MAKE SOMEONE A SELL OUT at all. Every other rapper in the world has collaborated with Rihanna or Wayne sometime (not the actual truth, but you get my meaning), so are they all sell outs too? Fuck no. You shouldn't judge songs by who's on them, you should judge the song by THE ACTUAL SONG. If Eminem wrote his best verse ever, and if it was on a Drake song, I wouldn't hate the song because Drake is on it too. That's stupid and closed minded. I don't see Lil Wayne's name and go "this is gonna be trash". I listen to it with an open mind, and if I like it I like it, if I don't, I don't. And I usually DON'T like his songs

every MAINSTREAM SELLOUT has collaborated with rihanna or wayne.....

also, if he did write that verse i'd acknowledge it. but he didn't. and why should he collab with shitty mainstream rappers when all they do is ruin the song and encourage me to fast forward to his verse......

[dead prez]

not entirely since i haven't delved into many mainstream rappers' music, although the overall quality of underground hiphop is MILES, if not LIGHTYEARS ahead of mainstream. i still believe eminem is a decent lyricist, just nothing like he was, and nothing like he could be

It has tons of options and more freedom, but underground isn't without shit. Actually expect a lot of shit in there, and you'll have to actually look deep to find some you like.

But Lupe Fiasco, Common, Nas, Kanye West, UGK, Outkast, Nas, Jay z, Ghostface, Raekwon J cole etc. You're going to have to check a lot of their old shit though. There's some great mainstream music, don't sleep or have your head up your ass thinking "lolz it undeground it's automatically good'.

[dead prez]

Eminem sold out. You can see it in his lyrics.

and fell off

[Master Chief]

Collaborations DON'T MAKE SOMEONE A SELL OUT at all. Every other rapper in the world has collaborated with Rihanna or Wayne sometime (not the actual truth, but you get my meaning), so are they all sell outs too? Fuck no. You shouldn't judge songs by who's on them, you should judge the song by THE ACTUAL SONG. If Eminem wrote his best verse ever, and if it was on a Drake song, I wouldn't hate the song because Drake is on it too. That's stupid and closed minded. I don't see Lil Wayne's name and go "this is gonna be trash". I listen to it with an open mind, and if I like it I like it, if I don't, I don't. And I usually DON'T like his songs

every MAINSTREAM SELLOUT has collaborated with rihanna or wayne.....

also, if he did write that verse i'd acknowledge it. but he didn't. and why should he collab with shitty mainstream rappers when all they do is ruin the song and encourage me to fast forward to his verse......

Nas, Jay-Z, T.I., J. Cole & Kanye West have collaborated with Wayne, Rihanna, Drake & Minaj. You're pretty much saying that 95% of the mainstream are sell-outs.

[whiteamerica]

not entirely since i haven't delved into many mainstream rappers' music, although the overall quality of underground hiphop is MILES, if not LIGHTYEARS ahead of mainstream. i still believe eminem is a decent lyricist, just nothing like he was, and nothing like he could be

It has tons of options and more freedom, but underground isn't without shit. Actually expect a lot of shit in there, and you'll have to actually look deep to find some you like.

But Lupe Fiasco, Common, Nas, Kanye West, UGK, Outkast, Nas, Jay z, Ghostface, Raekwon J cole etc. You're going to have to check a lot of their old shit though. There's some great mainstream music, don't sleep or have your head up your ass thinking "lolz it undeground it's automatically good'.

that's not what i was doing... if you look at oldschool mainstream it's not bad at all. although some of those guys you mentioned sold out too to stay mainstream.... if that's what they wanna do then so be it. but they lose my respect

[whiteamerica]

nas and jay-z--->sellouts

j cole--->eh i dont see the appeal with him

TI--->

edit: kanye, also sellout

[xxTrigger1989xx]

Collaborations DON'T MAKE SOMEONE A SELL OUT at all. Every other rapper in the world has collaborated with Rihanna or Wayne sometime (not the actual truth, but you get my meaning), so are they all sell outs too? Fuck no. You shouldn't judge songs by who's on them, you should judge the song by THE ACTUAL SONG. If Eminem wrote his best verse ever, and if it was on a Drake song, I wouldn't hate the song because Drake is on it too. That's stupid and closed minded. I don't see Lil Wayne's name and go "this is gonna be trash". I listen to it with an open mind, and if I like it I like it, if I don't, I don't. And I usually DON'T like his songs

every MAINSTREAM SELLOUT has collaborated with rihanna or wayne.....

also, if he did write that verse i'd acknowledge it. but he didn't. and why should he collab with shitty mainstream rappers when all they do is ruin the song and encourage me to fast forward to his verse......

The point still remains that collaborations don't make someone a sell out. How you go about the collaboration, then yeah, you could be a sell out. But Eminem hasn't sold out for collaborating with Wayne and Rihanna. I agree that I'd wish he'd work with people more on his skill level, but that's not my point. Who you collaborate with doesn't matter, because that's all they are. Collaborations. Eminem genuinely believes Wayne is dope and I can tell he likes working with him, I don't think "selling out" has anything to do with it

[whiteamerica]

The point still remains that collaborations don't make someone a sell out. How you go about the collaboration, then yeah, you could be a sell out. But Eminem hasn't sold out for collaborating with Wayne and Rihanna. I agree that I'd wish he'd work with people more on his skill level, but that's not my point. Who you collaborate with doesn't matter, because that's all they are. Collaborations. Eminem genuinely believes Wayne is dope and I can tell he likes working with him, I don't think "selling out" has anything to do with it

so you proved my point.... collaborations that are clearly done in order to sell. sell out. make someone a sellout.... what else do rihanna and wayne bring to the table besides radio plays and itunes downloads???

eminem coulda gotten any singer, eminem coulda collaborated with a SHITLOAD of better lyricists...

[xxTrigger1989xx]

The point still remains that collaborations don't make someone a sell out. How you go about the collaboration, then yeah, you could be a sell out. But Eminem hasn't sold out for collaborating with Wayne and Rihanna. I agree that I'd wish he'd work with people more on his skill level, but that's not my point. Who you collaborate with doesn't matter, because that's all they are. Collaborations. Eminem genuinely believes Wayne is dope and I can tell he likes working with him, I don't think "selling out" has anything to do with it

so you proved my point.... collaborations that are clearly done in order to sell. sell out. make someone a sellout.... what else do rihanna and wayne bring to the table besides radio plays and itunes downloads???

eminem coulda gotten any singer, eminem coulda collaborated with a SHITLOAD of better lyricists...

What? How did I prove your point, exactly? I said Eminem GENUINELY thinks Wayne is dope, sales have nothing to do with it. Wayne didn't sell Recovery, Em sold Recovery, with some help from Rihanna, I admit. But Rihanna wasn't put on the album TO SELL the album, because Em really wanted to work with Rihanna too. See, you gotta think about someone's intentions. Em never INTENDED for Recovery to be as popular as it is, that's just what ended up happening

I have not proven your point at all. Putting these artists on his songs DOES NOT make him a sell-out. I don't care what you say, but an artist's name being on a song shouldn't affect the way you listen to it (unless they are bad, of course, which is all up to personal opinion and not actual fact)

[whiteamerica]

eminem may not have wanted it to sell like it did... or maybe it wasnt his main focus. but obviously his label did...........

how can you know exactly what em thinks?

[classthe_king]

Trigger you are so naive lol. Eminem sold out, get over it. He completely changed his style, started rapping over pop beats with pop artists.