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Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

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Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby OMEGA » Apr 13th, '11, 17:46

Note: This is not another "Relapse vs Recovery" "Relapse was better" "Relapse sux" "Recovery is better" "Relapse is a classic" "Relapse is underrated" "Relapse almost made me cut my wrists" thread. This is a topic to discuss it as a concept album.

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I mean, look at this fucker. Just like the album itself, that cover art seems to have some layers of meaning to it. Yeah, the pill concept is pretty clear, but what about Em's face. What does it tell ya? Is he depressed? Is he sad? Is he taking a dump? Like the Monalisa, who the fuck knows. The dark background is like foreboding of what to expect in terms of content.

I'm still regularly bumping Relapse, and every time I hear it it doesn't cease to amaze me. At the same time though, I feel like it could have been so much more, and I'm disappointed that after all the bitching there was about it (and even Em decided to embrace it), we'll never see something as bold as this project.

All of Em's albums have been concept albums, or more specifically, "personal" concept albums. The SSLP was the introduction to the world to the Slim Shady persona, the MMLP was a deeper look at the sinister mind of Slim Shady and Marshall Mathers, The Eminem Show was an introspective view of the Eminem character and all the elements that revolved around him, and Encore was a demonstration of what fame can turn you into. Relapse, however, strikes to me as a more intricately designed, complex concept packed with imagery and metaphors that some may dismiss as an album that's not as "personal" as Em's past work, but that's only because they can't see the relationship between the concepts and themes touched here with the events Marshall experienced during his drug addiction era.

I already made the Em horrorcore thread, where I talked about how all this serial killer, maniac stuff could be a metaphor of all the hallucinations and fucked up stuff being an addict can turn you into, so I won't go to deep into it. I just want to talk about how much potential this whole concept had (and still has).

I think the main problem with the execution of Relapse was that Em didn't go all the way in. It's like 60% of the Relapse Eminem envisioned was mixed and mashed with 40% that barely had anything to do with it (and it clearly shows when you compare the quality of both things).
The album starts extremely well with the Dr. West skit and then 3 A.M, but some redundant (albeit enjoyable imo) songs start to appear later. Stuff like Bagpipes from Baghdad, We Made You, Old Time Sake, Crack a Bottle, even Beautiful (which I love) don't add anything to the experience, and they bring down the quality of it.

In a perfect world, Em would have created an album that, from beginning to end, would stick to the themes of songs like Buffalo Bill and Music Box, while also adding songs that explain the context of all these dark themes (Deja vu, Dr. West Skit, Underground) in order to create a more cohesive project that tries to do something that no one has done before. There are glimpses of that in Relapse, like in the Tonya -> Same Song and Dance Skit, but it would have been even better if all the songs and not only a couple were tied together as some sort of twisted dark tale.

Damn, I've made so many Relapse related threads because I fucking love the concepts Em touched here. Him branching out of the stuff he usually does or did in the past allowed him to create breathtaking songs like Stay Wide Awake. And to be honest, I do think that project exists (Refill is part of it), but we'll probably never had the chance to hear it unless it miraculously leaks somehow.

I really do hope next Em album, which is not going to be anything like Relapse sadly, tries to tackle on some kind of interesting concept and Em goes all the way with it. He's so fucking talented at creating compelling songs that you can see playing in your head even if you haven't seen a video about it.

Discuss. And read the whole thing ya fuckers.
Last edited by OMEGA on Apr 13th, '11, 18:02, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby Maybe » Apr 13th, '11, 17:54

There is no hidden meaning in the cover or the music. It isn't and wasn't intended to be a cover album; Eminem simply wrote stupid songs about rape, murder and random insults because he thought that's what his fans wanted.

You guys can search every lyric and all you'll find is an insecure pill addict with to much pressure from an overly obsessed fan base.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby dR3 » Apr 13th, '11, 17:56

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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby OMEGA » Apr 13th, '11, 17:57

Couldn't disagree more. If the songs were only full of "fuck yous" "I'll kill ya" "fag" references, I'd agree, but when you have songs that are beautifully constructed like Music Box there's absolutely no fucking way Em's intention was just to "shock" the audience.
Last edited by OMEGA on Apr 13th, '11, 18:11, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby Edge » Apr 13th, '11, 18:44

this album is clasic because its such a good concept album. i think some songs shouldve been taken off and some from relapse refill shouldve been added to the origional. its up there with his first 3 cds for me and i think the concepts/stories on this cd r rediculous
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby Devil'sAdvocate » Apr 13th, '11, 18:46

Relapse is a classic,i listened today.

its my 3rd favorite eminem album.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby Kez » Apr 13th, '11, 19:30

Relapse could have been really great if, like the OP says, he had gone all the way in.

First of all, We Made You was a bad idea. Clearly made for the same reasons i'm gonna talk about with Crack a Bottle further down, it doesn't really fit in the concept. This is the problem. Most of the album follows the concept (as OP rightly said), then you get to We Made You and he randomly starts calling himself a rock star and rapping about celebrities, then goes back to the concept (until later on anyway)

Dunno why you list Bagpipes and shit as bad things, that song fit the album perfectly. The problem with Relapse is the pressure he was under to make a comeback, which resulted in some filler songs, especially nearer the end. Beautiful is the antithesis of the whole album's theme, a cookie-cutter stereotypical "Eminem song" which was made to appeal to people who's last Eminem song they heard was probably When I'm Gone. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the song, it just didn't fit Relapse and it's an obvious ploy. It even leans on the device of using a rock sample for the chorus (as if to try and remind people of Sing For The Moment) and lyrics about how depressed he is.

Crack a Bottle is an abysmally obvious lazy song which was only added because they wanted to grab hold of the fact that a leaked Em song got a good reception, probably unconfident about if he could actually make a comeback after so long. Underground is a poor attempt at being edgy which just fell completely flat on its face in so many ways. In my opinion this is an awesome album until it comes time to close. Every song fits until after Deja Vu; imo Deja Vu could have been the closer, or one of the final tracks with something else after it to finish off.

On top of that, some of the tracks don't really link together too well. Deja Vu/Mr. Mathers, Dr. West/3AM (though I maintain My Darling works better after Dr. West) and Tonya/Same Song and Dance were awesome, but stuff like Old Time's Sake (which feels kinda like an excuse to just have Dre on a song) and Medicine Ball seem poorly placed and not really linked too well to the theme.

In terms of the concept itself I do give him respect, first of all for actually daring to come back after so long with an album that is so vastly different to what everyone expected, and also for creating a pretty decent concept. I don't think it's an impossibly-hard concept to think of by any means, but at least he didn't come back with a bunch of whining shit, basically what Beautiful is.

And don't ask me to list my "ideal Relapse tracklist", cause I aint doing that lmao. I shouldn't have to piece his album together for him, and I aint going to try to do it with Refill or leaked tracks. He tried it and he missed his opportunity, then he decided to start dissing his own album on Recovery. So fuck that.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby momentsgolden » Apr 13th, '11, 20:56

First off, Beautifull was the most heart-felt Eminem track on the album. His "real" comeback album was full of Beautifull, Apple, Difficult, Carefull what you wish for etc. It was written without an album, concept, sales in mind. Written from the heart. In his own words see...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/2009/ma ... ic-relapse

Secondly, Horrocore is NOT a "new" and/or "different" concept. Eminem grew up on that. Any pre-99 interviews will let you know. He had to "re-learn" to rap again and used his "basic" concept.. how he actually STARTED. Add to that tracks like My Name is.. a relapse to his old habits. Barely any growth. Important nonetheless.

As a concept, however, i agree with the OP. It was daring to put it out esp considering how low his self-esteem was. Same song and Dance is still one of my favourite tracks because it is how I would have loved the album to be presented.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby OneDream_89 » Apr 13th, '11, 22:53

I would like to see EmBase post in this thread :flutter:
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby xxTrigger1989xx » Apr 13th, '11, 23:42

Ya know what...I agree. I love both Relapse and Recovery, but I see Relapse as a concept album the same way that you do, a metaphor for all the fucked up shit he was thinking. Must Be The Ganja actually kinda touches on this...but I don't agree on Bagpipes, I love Bagpipes and it fits the album quite well.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby xxTrigger1989xx » Apr 13th, '11, 23:56

C.R.E.A.M wrote:
xxTrigger1989xx wrote:I love both Relapse and Recovery.


These are to specs that cannot combine in a normal human being , WHO are you ?

#justsaying


I am Eminem, of course...

But really, I know that's kind of a contradiction, but it is fully possible to like both albums. I love Recovery a little more, though, and I listen to both often.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby BigBangBazinga » Apr 14th, '11, 10:08

Devil'sAdvocate wrote:Relapse is a classic,i listened today.

its my 3rd favorite eminem album.



After Infinite & Encore. Right? Riiiiight?
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby BigBangBazinga » Apr 14th, '11, 12:28

C.R.E.A.M wrote:
BigBangBazinga wrote:
Devil'sAdvocate wrote:Relapse is a classic,i listened today.

its my 3rd favorite eminem album.



After Infinite & Encore. Right? Riiiiight?


Relapse is a great album and it's close to Classic imo
Encore is good .. but not close to Classic
Infinite > Both of em tbh , but running with a Nas flow makes it a copycat Classic and thats it
Even tho 313 is my shit




That's 50% troll huh?
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby randomgirl » Apr 14th, '11, 18:53

Relapse would've been slightly better without the accent, but it's really not THAT bad. Most of the time he slips in & out of the accent, so it's not like the whole album has it. I can live with it. I do wonder what 3 AM would sound like without it, though. But overall I like Relapse. It does have its weak moments, but all of his albums do.
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Re: Let's talk RELAPSE as a concept album

Postby Manly Moose » Apr 14th, '11, 21:55

This is how I see relapse.

1. "Dr. West" (skit)
2. "3 a.m." This track is great, sets the mood, and makes
3. "My Mom" Annoying as hell to listen to + overused subject matter
4. "Insane" Kinda nice, but some lines got me scratching my head.
5. "Bagpipes from Baghdad" Accent ruins this for me
6. "Hello" Nice beat, but again with weird lyrics
7. "Tonya" (skit)
8. "Same Song & Dance" Nice
9. "We Made You" No
10. "Medicine Ball" Annoying as fuck
11. "Paul" (skit)
12. "Stay Wide Awake" Good track but it sounds boring as the subject matter is rather worn out
13. "Old Time's Sake" (featuring Dr. Dre) No
14. "Must Be the Ganja" Annoying as fuck
15. "Mr. Mathers" (skit)
16. "Déjà Vu" Amazing track
17. "Beautiful" Good track
18. "Crack a Bottle" (featuring Dr. Dre & 50 Cent) No
19. "Steve Berman" (skit)
20. "Underground" Ok

Its as good a concept album as Last Train to Paris (Not very good). The album doesnt really tell a story, it might but I don't see it so many tracks had such poor execution and lyrically Ems almost never on point, ruining it. A lot of the time it seems like hes just spewing random crazy shit . Very few tracks stand out as worth listening to more than once.
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