Rap Hits a Ceiling

[I'mShady]

THANK YOU GOD!!!
I've been talking about this since 2005/06, and I'm glad someone else has the same opinion as me. All of the rappers these days don't amount to the talent of the rappers back in the late 90's and early 00s. Let's say the three best rappers these days(optional) J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Big K.R.I.T. to go against the Nas or Jay-Z or the Eminem from back then?
They lose big time...Rap has reached the artistic peak and that's kinda sad.

[I'mShady]

THANK YOU GOD!!!
I've been talking about this since 2005/06, and I'm glad someone else has the same opinion as me. All of the rappers these days don't amount to the talent of the rappers back in the late 90's and early 00s. Let's say the three best rappers these days(optional) J. Cole, Kendrick Lamar, Big K.R.I.T. to go against the Nas or Jay-Z or the Eminem from back then?
They lose big time...Rap has reached the artistic peak and that's kinda sad.

The next generation will be better. See, we realize this and so the generation after these debutantes will notice it too.

???
Wait... what???
How do you know??? What evidence do you have to show me? Where did you get this from?
How has the present generation of hip-hop contributed towards the culture?
They're still living off Eminem's fame and flow, Jay-Z's swag and Kanye's beats. So yeah in lamens terms...they are horrendous. Their contribution toward the future of hiphop has been less then 0.

[Sukot]

I kind of agree. And I can honestly see in 30 years down the line there being practically no young people that like hip hop. It just seems to be heading that way.

[_Hawk_]

Well said Menzo

[EminemBase]

There's somewhat of a point to this except for a few things...

Firstly, the leaps in the beginning of a genre or art form are always going to be huger. With the exception of things like film where quantum leaps (so to speak) can still happen at any point and you never know what new innovation or idea is around the corner...

the premise of rhyming and flowing, I mean... it started out primitive and we've gone through huge leaps to get to where we're at. So of course the new are not going to seem as impressive as the new would of in the prior decades, when the leaps were happening.

Also, you can't directly compare Eminem to any other rapper really as he is unique and always has been in the sense, he writes like a writer. Maybe not lately, with trying to adapt with the puns and everything but generally speaking, his verses often sound like conversations where the rhymes are naturally falling into place. Rarely does it sound contrived or awkward.

There's always a fluid nature to his writing and he always focuses on improving himself and to an obsessive degree. Most other 'greats' don't do that, or certainly not in the same way he does. They just continue to do what they do, over and over. Which is why they eventually sound tired and old. Where as Em, he constantly examines himself and culture and adapts.

[Sukot]

I kind of agree. And I can honestly see in 30 years down the line there being practically no young people that like hip hop. It just seems to be heading that way.

We can always hope for a huge war or a gargantuan plague to strike Earth to force a lot of people into poverty and forcing them to resort to rhymes...right?

That's not what I meant.

Just, that I think hip hop is dwindling as a genre of music, and as a culture. So I don't think there'll be many of those "future generations" that you speak of, to come, and I think they'll get smaller and smaller, until it becomes one of those obscure genres which like 1,000 people listen to, and rappers won't be able to "make it" anymore, since it won't be a commercially viable genre. There'll come a point where the genre won't be popular enough for people to make careers out of it.

And at the rate hip hop has been going the past few years, I honestly think that could be the case in only a matter of decades.

[I'mShady]

The next generation will be better. See, we realize this and so the generation after these debutantes will notice it too.

???
Wait... what???
How do you know??? What evidence do you have to show me? Where did you get this from?
How has the present generation of hip-hop contributed towards the culture?
They're still living off Eminem's fame and flow, Jay-Z's swag and Kanye's beats. So yeah in lamens terms...they are horrendous. Their contribution toward the future of hiphop has been less then 0.

Calm the fuck down, first.

Second, I don't know but I believe in it. There are only a few in the current flock of new guys that I find fascinating such as B.o.B, Kendrick Lamar and Yelawolf (there are a few others).

What I'm saying is though...this new wave of rappers all sound the same. No one is doing anything very groundbreaking or risky - to me - and I feel like the generation after this new one will want to reinvent Hip-Hop and revitalize it back to it's pinnacle as a result of being disgusted by what's happening right now.

Hell, it's how I feel. It's like when the fans dumb down, so do the artists

Now my hopefulness in this theory is already broke when I see young 14 year old "emcees" from Young Money getting videos on YouTube and being called dope by 'fans'. Hopefully YM gets weeded out though, i fuckin hate them. And hopefully my theory isn't completely shitted on and the next generation is influenced to just continue making dumber, generic music

I kind of agree. And I can honestly see in 30 years down the line there being practically no young people that like hip hop. It just seems to be heading that way.

We can always hope for a huge war or a gargantuan plague to strike Earth to force a lot of people into poverty and forcing them to resort to rhymes...right?

Yeah, I feel you but I think it's time to finaly stop looking at rappers like wow that was good and brand him as a "dope artist" or a "dope rapper" or whatever. The genre has stagnated since like the first Blueprint man... It's all a recreation of what they've seen so far in rap history. Even the incredible Section 80 was a Tupac mixed with a bit of Nas and Jay. Even Cole World was Tupac, Eminem and all of these other dudes. NO ONE is taking a leap of faith. Tyler is cool but he's fucking Eminem mixed with... I don't know A Tribe Called Quest lol.

[_Hawk_]

....he always focuses on improving himself and to an obsessive degree. Most other 'greats' don't do that, or certainly not in the same way he does. They just continue to do what they do, over and over. Which is why they eventually sound tired and old. Where as Em, he constantly examines himself and culture and adapts.

Very true, but this argument is limited. What has he been rapping about in his last tracks which he's released? Hoes, sluts, bitches, violence and rape. Nothing new there at all. I believe that Em always focuses on improving himself, but the difference is that he went from not giving a fuck to giving one. He has started listening to his critics and his fans, and gone back to studying his earlier releases to return to that content; readress it and expand it. He has a wide base of themes to work on (more so than any other rapper that is note-worthy) but it's wrong to suggest that every new release introduces new themes (your post is quite ambiguous mate, so sorry in advance if you're not suggesting this at all). Since Encore, every record has been more reactionary (in terms of evolution) than revolutionary.
As far as improvement goes, that's definitely true. He's a hard worker; a hip-hop nerd and a perfectionist. His work ethic speaks volumes.

But it's easy to be picky when seeking perfection as fans.

[Sam.]

Granted I agree on Em's current topics are redundant, I would also like to remind people that none of this stuff is for his album lol Maybe that's why I don't really get upset like 90% of the forum? I realize that Em is a perfectionist with regards to his own work, or things with meaning. If Em's next album has songs that just relate to hating hos and stuff...then, THEN I will join the flocks of people in annoyance.

Sometimes I feel that the songs that he does before any Album reflects his mind state that he is in and it does show up in his Albums some what. He did "Forever" right around the time when he was done with Relapse 1 & 2 (I guess), the way that he approached that song did reflect on Recovery. I can attribute the reason of hate towards this song to this point, although I can be terribly wrong with this theory.

[Sukot]

Granted I agree on Em's current topics are redundant, I would also like to remind people that none of this stuff is for his album lol Maybe that's why I don't really get upset like 90% of the forum? I realize that Em is a perfectionist with regards to his own work, or things with meaning. If Em's next album has songs that just relate to hating hos and stuff...then, THEN I will join the flocks of people in annoyance.

Sometimes I feel that the songs that he does before any Album reflects his mind state that he is in and it does show up in his Albums some what. He did "Forever" right around the time when he was done with Relapse 1 & 2 (I guess), the way that he approached that song did reflect on Recovery. I can attribute the reason of hate towards this song to this point, although I can be terribly wrong with this theory.

You could be right, although I think the fact that Lil Wayne (and to a lesser extent, Drake and Kanye West) was on the song was also a large reason for the hate it got. And also, the beat is the sort of thing a lot of Eminem fans wouldn't like. So it's probably a combination of a few things.

[Sam.]

Lol what?Eminem's Forever verse was dope as fuck, it was not bad at all and I didn't even mean that.

[Sukot]

Lol what?Eminem's Forever verse was dope as fuck, it was not bad at all and I didn't even mean that.

Ha. Sorry man. I like Em's verse too (infact, I like the song as a whole). I was just giving a few reasons why a lot of people don't like the song (but you didn't even mean that anyway).

[Elision]

this is the dumbest/most arrogant thread in the fuckin world

[Trimss]

this is the dumbest/most arrogant thread in the fuckin world

I came to the conclusion Tech N9ne didn't catch the cypher.

[Ethos]

To an extent I do agree with the article. A lot of cats these days do not try to be original, but it is hard to be original when everything has been said. Like someone already said, some artists seem to show signs of being a mixture of all their idols. Which is no problem at all, we all learn by taking present practices and try to make a style out of it. But I would say content that is said is where this argument has any solid points. Hip Hop (and any other type of music) is not just about your lyrics but how you present it.

Take a look at Busta Rhymes: Shit lyrics when you read them on paper, but the way he presents himself, and how he says things makes him one of the greats. Like Andre 3000, if you read his lyrics you'd be like wtf, but then you hear it and you're like I see it. Some artists can present themselves on paper and off (like Em).

And yes, a lot of these artists have the lyrical ability. They can write vivid images, but their presentation sounds the same as the last guy. That's where I think hey are right when they say that it seems like rap's at a standstill. No one is standing out as much. Out of the new rappers, I'd have to say Kendrick Lamar has been the only one to standout to me because of his quick calm flow.

This is all strictly opinion though. And I'm writing on an iPod so if there is anything I need to clear up that I wrote just ask