EminemBase....

[MikeNUFC]

What did you think of the first episode of 'Life's Too Short'?

Was it just me that thought that Warwick Davis was written as a small David Brent? His mannerisms and all were just so Brent.

Concept seemed decent but it was all too predictable for me...

[Sekou]

When you open a topic by MikeNUFC titled "EminemBase", you're thinking shits about to go doooooown, but instead we get this

[EminemBase]

What did you think of the first episode of 'Life's Too Short'?

Was it just me that thought that Warwick Davis was written as a small David Brent? His mannerisms and all were just so Brent.

Concept seemed decent but it was all too predictable for me...

It was alright. I think this series will get better as it goes on.

I've seen people saying that Warwick Davis was doing a bad 'Gervais impression' but almost everybody in Gervais/Merchant comedies do a 'bad Gervais impression'.

There's a certain style, which is very predictable now, which always comes through in their writing / when they direct now. The constant pausing and rephrasing, the awkward coughing etc. it's a style of comedic delivery that they can't help themselves but go with constantly.

It was maybe emphasized with Davis but he's different from Brent anyway in the sense that Brent wasn't neccesarily consciously manipulative. Brent was quite happy to be 'part of the crowd' as long as he was involved, and other than being a bit pretentious and lacking in self-awareness, had the potential of being a nice guy beyond his flaws.

Where as Davis, they're saying that he's going to be fully manipulative and he seems more aware of himself and what he's doing. Just like the key difference between Brent and Millman was self-awareness. People say Gervais plays the same character but Andy Millman was nothing like David Brent. Andy Millman was intelligent, self-aware, depressed and annoyed with people.

So, I'll reserve judgement until I see a few more episodes at least.

[MikeNUFC]

I'd agree that Brent has more depth about his character, but then again, we've only seen Warwick's character for one episode, se he may develop more as the show goes on.

Do you agree that Gervias could be doing something more though? He's an exceptional writer but doesn't seem to step out of his comfort zone, with the whole social awkwardness thing. It's still funny, but because The Office perfected it, I can't help but compare it to that. The characters have fundamental differences but the situations and certain mannerisms are too similar to ignore.

[EminemBase]

I'd agree that Brent has more depth about his character, but then again, we've only seen Warwick's character for one episode, se he may develop more as the show goes on.

Do you agree that Gervias could be doing something more though? He's an exceptional writer but doesn't seem to step out of his comfort zone, with the whole social awkwardness thing. It's still funny, but because The Office perfected it, I can't help but compare it to that. The characters have fundamental differences but the situations and certain mannerisms are too similar to ignore.

Well yeah he could be doing something more and the whole idea and concept, and even title for 'Life's Too Short' was from Davis. Yet it will go down in history as 'Gervais' creation', which is a little unfair. Even though Gervais / Merchant wrote and directed it, its concept came from Davis.

What Gervais does which is admirable is the same thing that Louis CK does, in, intentionally taking audiences to places they feel uncomfortable in and finding the comedy in them. Exploiting the social anxiety and lack of clarity in these areas, for comedic effect and to openly talk about taboo.

So, it's rarely arbitrary with them. He's using comedy for important ideas.

But yeah I often think that many of my heroes could be doing more. I have ideas constantly that I wish I could just execute with Eminem's talent or Gervais' talent as I feel they're better than a lot of the ideas I see them do themselves. Which seems arrogant but I really do see a lot of geniuses squander their talent in small spaces of interest, and lacking in originality.

Gervais also contradicts himself a lot as he said after 'Cemetery Junction' that they had left that "veil of irony" behind and they'd no longer be laughing at their characters so much as engaging and empathizing with them more. Yet, with 'Life's Too Short' he's gone backwards again.

He also said that comedy without pathos or drama or something underneath it is decapitated laughter and pretty pointless (paraphrasing), and again, with LTS, he said it's 'all funny' and that it's not a comedy/drama but an out-and-out comedy.

His or rather, his and Merchant's (though I think the style is more-so Gervais') style has become very predictable now and watching Davis do those little looks to the camera and the eyebrow raises in awkward moments, and the constant stopping and stuttering in sentences felt like a major repeat and also as if I could do it myself now.

I'm sure it'll still be funny but I think he should be thinking bigger and as much as I love attention to detail and certainly realism, I think he just obsesses far too much on nuanced awkwardness now. I love awkward comedy but... Larry David is an example of somebody who does it better now. You rarely see people stuttering and losing their way on 'Curb' as you do in Gervais' work and yet it feels as, if not more, realistic and cringing.

And David has found a way to exercise often surreal ideas in a realistic context. Which, is better. As he can go more places, it's more flexible, he can think bigger.

One more thing, seems as if Gervais' standards or appreciation of comedic worth are lowering. He said the scene they did with Liam Neeson they feel is maybe the funniest scene they've ever wrote. Which I know they say every series but... it's not even close in my books.

There's a ton of legendary scenes from both 'The Office' and 'Extras' that are SO much funnier than that. Even the 'muffin scene' from 'Extras'. Or the Keith Chegwin scene where he confuses fiction with reality... those ideas and scenes are so so much funnier.

[MikeNUFC]

The Liam Neeson scene was probably the funniest moment of the episode but it had nothing on moments during The Office's Training Day, for example. The stamp conversation, for example, is pretty much perfection - every single detail is delightful.

Now we're on the subject of great Office/Extras scenes I'm just gunna post a couple and change the whole thread.

[EminemBase]

One of my favourite Office scenes...



I think Gervais is way off the mark, to the nth degree in saying the Liam Neeson scene is the funniest they've ever written. Again, obviously he will say that but, seems like he really feels it. Almost every single classic scene from even Extras shits on it.

[EminemBase]

^ Well I don't like the last two as much. And the Orlando Bloom is easily my least favourite Extras episode. I haven't seen Orlando in much else but I thought he was terrible in that.

I know he was doing a self-parody and trying to indulge a little but... he just seemed like a genuinely bad actor in it. Really unconvincing and unnatural.

But yeah the Patrick Stewart scene? aw man, the Liam Neeson scene doesn't touch the sides of it.

[RKOunion]

Can someone tell me which version of The Office should is superior? What's the difference?

I've been meaning to watch some good comedy. Maybe I'll try The Office since I hear alot of praise for it.

[EminemBase]

Can someone tell me which version of The Office should is superior? What's the difference?

I've been meaning to watch some good comedy. Maybe I'll try The Office since I hear alot of praise for it.

The original (UK) Office is far superior in my opinion.

The American version is surprisingly good and I originally went into it with folded arms thinking it would be a cheap rip-off and an embarrassment... and, the first few episodes in it kind of is...

But then as it progresses it takes on a life of its own and it is genuinely brilliant.

But the original Office is superior as:
- It's much more realistic
- It has pathos and drama that are convincing and affecting
- The love triangle between Tim / Dawn / Lee is executed to perfection
- Brent (Michael Scott in US) has more depth and nuance

And generally speaking, the characters are less like caricatures and more like real people. And this wouldn't necessarily always make a show better but considering it's a mockumentary, in this instance it definitely does as if you believe the reality more, everything is emphasized.

The Office (UK) is a comedy masterpiece down to the finest detail. It borrowed a lot of elements, and more than most UK comedy fans would know of but, it's A-Grade work.

Oh and just simplistically speaking, beyond the realism and eye for detail, it's just funnier. There are many moments of serious hilarity in the US version too but the best moments of the UK version are just unbeatable and some of the funniest things I have ever seen, ever.

And as a result of the hyper-realism and finer detail, the cringe moments are more cringing. It's an almost flawless piece of work.

I don't think you should however choose one over the other. I always find it bizarre when people ask for recommendations instead of just finding out themselves. I think you should start with the original regardless of quality since that's where it started. So it makes sense, considering the US version was an upshot of the UK version and not visa versa.

But if you love comedy and are or wish to be a student of it, study it all.

[Beak]

"EminemBase" got me excited 4 a minute

[EminemBase]

Hey Embase, What would you say your 3 best Curb moments are? I Don't think I have seen anyone on this site liking Curb that much. Epic show.

Best THREE? man that's hard.

It's hard because I often... laugh hardest at the moments of nuanced observation rather than 'big caper comedy' or the situations he creates. I still love the situations and the way he makes plots intertwine, and I find it ingenious but that's maybe more admiration than it being funny to me...

So, I'm struggling whether to put the bits I find funniest or whether to put the bits there which aren't necessarily hilarious to me but which in comedy terms are just, such 'big' ideas...

Leme try these:
1. The Anonymous Donor (when Larry is furious over Funkhouser's pretentiousness)
2. The Grand Opening (swearing scene)
3. Terrorist Attack (when Larry suggests he could stay and play golf)

That's kind of arbitrary though and I could easily pick another three, and another and another, or swap those three around. Sorry to be so pedantic and unsure but I find things like this almost impossible to truly 'rate', it's really hard to nail down what you like 'more' sometimes...

I guess you just wanted three special moments though. Those are three.

More recently, one of my favourite episodes was the ending to Season 7. The way he folded in the Seinfeld and Curb worlds in on each other like that was genius.

[MikeNUFC]

Didn't Merchant say that the Dawn/Tim story is really what the programme is all about, and not Brent. The way it's built up is incredible. I think Tim and Lee's interactions are one of the best parts of the story, so well written and acted (as is the whole thing, but this in particualr), the attention to detail is amazing.

Training Day is still my favourite episode. Not many things funnier than "I think there's been a rape up here", "sometimes the complaints will be false" or "she's deeeeaddd... she's not dead". Genius.

[EminemBase]

Didn't Merchant say that the Dawn/Tim story is really what the programme is all about, and not Brent. The way it's built up is incredible. I think Tim and Lee's interactions are one of the best parts of the story, so well written and acted (as is the whole thing, but this in particualr), the attention to detail is amazing.

Training Day is still my favourite episode. Not many things funnier than "I think there's been a rape up here", "sometimes the complaints will be false" or "she's deeeeaddd... she's not dead". Genius.

Yeah well Gervais' common sound bite has been to say "people tuned in for Brent, but stayed watching for Tim and Dawn". So, Brent was the draw but Tim and Dawn were the underbelly.

I never personally continued watching for that reason though. It obviously compels the story and plots forward but Brent's breakdowns were always much more fascinating to me.

As he was a wilfully deluded man who whilst seeming totally unaware of his flaws, at times he showed cracks in the armour. Such as when he got serious with Tim and gave him a talking down for the sexual picture with his head on... and then acted like it was fine again when it was Finchy.

Also of course the scene where he begs for his job back. Which I honestly mean, is one of the best dramatic acting scenes I've ever seen. So, whilst even Gervais himself sort of somewhat shrug Brent off as a comedy figure and Tim and Dawn as the real spirit to the show... I mean, Brent was going downhill in many ways and trying to cling on too. I always watched for Brent.

[MikeNUFC]

Also of course the scene where he begs for his job back. Which I honestly mean, is one of the best dramatic acting scenes I've ever seen. So, whilst even Gervais himself sort of somewhat shrug Brent off as a comedy figure and Tim and Dawn as the real spirit to the show... I mean, Brent was going downhill in many ways and trying to cling on too. I always watched for Brent.

Yeah, I think it's perfect how they make Brent to be an idiot but not someone the audience will dislike (like Lee or Finchy). His idiotic persona only adds to the sympathy you feel for him during the Xmas episode (well, I do anyway). The scene where he's begging for his job is the perfect leveller for what's to come, as it's the most obvious moment (there are of course smaller moments) where his true side, behind his 'boss' persona, comes out.

Him telling Finchy to fuck off is so brilliant, especially as it's the same time that Neil becomes really dislikeable, so it's almost a double whammy.