Can Em ever make a mature album?

[Johnny Quid]

No.

[Man1x]

This thread took an awful turn. I'm not even getting into the OP discussion, there's something I want to address right in the middle of it.

I said overall, now tell me an album where Yeezy doesn't have three songs about materialism, bitches, and humor. Name one, and it has to be a rap album. Not an R&B album intended to attract teenage girls (that says nothing about the quality so don't go ape shit).

"An R&B album intended to attract teenage girls"? I realize what you're doing with this thread, but that claim is hilarious. That basically translates into an arrogance and delusion. So, basically, you're accusing everybody that thinks 808s & Heartbreak is a good album of sharing the same taste of music with teenage girls? I assume it's the same with other albums that aren't Hip Hop, such as.. WZRD? Nostalgia, Ultra? A Thousand Suns? That's a huge sentence you just said, but I ain't even getting into this because everybody who isn't a "loyal" hip hop fan knows exactly how hilarious to read that claim is.

Oh, MBDTF.

The whole album is a metaphor for Kanye's career up to this point

Dark Fantasy is his introduction into the rap game

Gorgeous is Kanye hitting back on everybody who doubted him and the beat switch for Raekwon's verse is to symbolise the fact that 'Ye is on the same track as one of his idols, futher proving that he's made it

POWER is a key track, this is Kanye at his most cocky, confident, but most vulnerable state of mind, as the song goes on you can see that the fame is starting to that it's tole, "this will be a beautiful death, jumping out the window, letting everything go". This really sets the tone for the rest of the album

All of The Lights is Kanye describing his personal problems, again that fame has brought on him, listen closely to the hook, "I want you to see everything, EVERYTHING, all of the Lights" - all of the lights = metaphor for problems, and you'll hear the phrase being used 2-3 more times on the album

Monster = 'Ye's response to the Taylor Swift incident, "gossip, gossip, ni**ga just stop it, everybody knows I'm a mothafuckin' monster"

So Appalled I'm not too sure about, I think it could be Kanye again hitting back at the criticism he got over the Taylor Swift incident, Jay also uses this track to hit back at his critics, and Pusha also drops one the "realest" verses of his career

Devil in New Dress is the start of Kanye's relationship issues (which is the theme for the next 2 songs as well). This is 'Ye reflecting on the times he spent with his girl, the guitar solo is used to add to the "reflective" theme of this song

Runaway is another key track possibly the biggest song of West's career, and maybe the biggest moment of clarity I’ve heard on a rap album. Like Devil in a New Dress, the first half of this song is also a reflective track. It starts off with how ‘Ye doesn’t care how he treats women, “I sent this girl a picture of my dick”, as the goes on though you can see that Kanye gradually starts to show remorse, and the final 3 minutes is basically Kanye crying/breaking down into a vocoder after he’s finally realised what he’s done. The first minute and a half of this is very distorted because ‘Ye’s mind is all over the place, but as things start to sink in, everything becomes clear (Kanye’s thoughts and what he was mumbling into the vocoder).

Hell of A Life is Kanye going on a drug fuelled rampage to try and forget what happened

Blame Game is his break up with Amber Rose. All the different voice effects on here are used to convey Kanye’s emotions. This is also another song where he uses the phrase “all of the lights” when talking about his problems. The Chris Rock skit at the end is the scene that Kanye talks about at the end of his part of the song. It’s a weird skit because the first time I heard it I laughed, then when I actually thought about how I’d react if I rang my girl and heard this kind of conversation going on, I felt sympathetic for ‘Ye.

Lost in The World is another key track, this is where Kanye is at at this moment and time. It starts off with Kanye being lost, broken, and just feeling totally fucked. But as it goes on ‘Ye becomes more optimistic, and in this song he drops a positive verse which describes Kanye getting back on his feet. “Run from the LIGHTS, run from the night” – Kanye is finally escaping the problems that plagued him throughout the album

That my thoughts on the albums concept, I could be totally wrong, but fuck it!

From TR's one and only, KillahBee.

Only mentioned it because people dick ride Eminem and Kanye West like they are the second coming of Christ. It's annoying and makes me hate these two. I mean c'mon people it gets old, no artist is perfect. Also, remember when everyone hated Justin Bieber? That was before he was associated with Kanye West. Now everyone likes him in order to make sure Kanye West isn't considered a sell out. Btw I never hated him but it's funny how some people's opinions change so fast.

Well indeed, but nowadays people label every fan a dickrider which is a complete turn-off for a rational discussion. Oh and about that Justin Bieber thingy, when did Kanye West not collaborate with popstars though? How could he be labelled a sell-out for doing something that he always did? Not to mention that he did some crazy verses and production with Runaway Love Remix, it wasn't even a Bieber song, basically it was a Wu-Tang song with that production.

And I don't even like Bieber, I generally hate Bieber's music, but would I say he isn't talented at all? No, I wouldn't. And unfortunately for us biased beings that automatically translates into "He's either trying to make excuses for collaborating with Kanye or he's a closet Bieber fan".

I swear Hip Hop forums are hilarious, I abandon thread.

I'll give you that I was wrong to say 808 was an album directed toward teenage girls, but no on a lot of other things. People seriously dick ride Eminem and Kanye West here as hard as they can, and I'm not even just saying that. You'd think these two are perfect if you listened to their dick riders here. Also, I stand by my Bieber comment. However, I don't think you're a closet Bieber fan or making excuses for Ye, and I agree he's actually a talented individual. I still hate his music though. People mainly hate on Bieber because they are jealous or because he doesn't always write his songs (he definitely doesn't write his raps). However, I saw people that hate Bieber do a complete 360 once he collaborated with Kanye West, you can't deny that. And don't get me wrong, I love Kanye West. I have his whole discography and listen to him occasionally, hell lately I've played him more than Eminem because he is more active in the game with new material. But it pisses me off when Kanye fans come into this forum with a double standard against Eminem and paint all of Kanye's best qualities as the definition of the best rapper and demonize Eminem's, and vise versa.

[Man1x]

I'll give you that I was wrong to say 808 was an album directed toward teenage girls, but no on a lot of other things. People seriously dick ride Eminem and Kanye West here as hard as Rey can, and I'm not even just saying that. You'd think these two are perfect if you listened to their dick riders here. Also, I stand by my Bieber comment. However, I don't think you're a closet Bieber fan or making excuses for Ye, and I agree he's actually a talented individual. I still hate his music though. People mainly hate on Bieber because they are jealous or because he doesn't always write his songs (he definitely doesn't write his raps). However, I saw people that hate Bieber do a complete 360 once he collaborated with Kanye West, you can't deny that.

I haven't seen the Bieber hate do a 360 after the Kanye collab, I've seen the Bieber hate do a 360 after Boyfriend, which I can't entirely judge because I never heard that track, but that's what's visible to my eyes, the Kanye West Runaway Love remix isn't even commercially big to do a 360 because and a lot of people haven't even heard it, seeing how it was released free on a GOOD Friday and it was basically Raekwon's track.

But it pisses me off when Kanye fans come into this forum with a double standard against Eminem and paint all of Kanye's best qualities as the definition of the best rapper and demonize Eminem's, and vise versa.

That's the key, "vice-versa", seeing how Eminem fans and other general Hip Hop fans have completely opposite point of views, you can expect the debate to continue in every thread. While a part CAN be biased, that's only because the other part is biased as well, and a counter-argument of the same type is necessary.

I'm talking about a 360 at the forbidden forum, not any where else for obviously reasons like you said. And not everyone at forbidden forum did a 360, but I definitely noticed it. To be completely honest though, a lot of people still hate Justin Bieber, and some even more, after Boyfriend. Finally, yeah I included vise versa and finish this thread with the fact that both lyrics and beats matter in MUSIC (not aimed at you because I think you get the point). People got to realize that if you ain't entertaining but spit the best rhymes you don't deserve to be called an artists, maybe a poet. Last time I checked, however, rap is music. That's not to say lyrics aren't important, they most certainty are. Nearly everything is important in rap, not just the things you pick and choose. That's where hip hop forums fail in general, and that's why you have dumb ass underground rappers complaining about not being as big as Lil Wayne.
/thread

Edit:
I guess that's why I like the Black Hippy movement so much now that I think about it, and my reason for liking Eminem's older music a shit load. That's also why I stand by Late Registration > My Beautiful Dark Twisted Fantasy. Late Registration wasn't packed with multis, which is the definition of lyrical on this forum when it's actually only one factor, but it had deep lyrics.

[EminemInsider]

"Mature"...stupidest, most overused and misunderstood word by Eminem fans.

[EminemBase]

"Mature"...stupidest, most overused and misunderstood word by Eminem fans.

[Emadyville]

Terrible thread reaches new heights.

or new lows

[UofLCard]

:facepalm2

people want old em then they complain about him not acting his age

It's a juxtaposition if I ever saw one on here.

[Emadyville]

:facepalm2

people want old em then they complain about him not acting his age

It's a juxtaposition if I ever saw one on here.

I couldnt help but laugh at the irony

[Man In The Mirror]

Even his serious songs now, he has to use immature lines like "nipple is mine for the milking". Come on.

Uhhh, in what fucking world are you living in if you think that line is immature? It's a clever metaphor about "owning" the rap game, and he's milking it (farmers OWN their animals, and milking them...).

Plus it's part of an even more clever wordplay with the "ML King/ milking".

ML King? What does it stand for? And should it not be MIL King?

[Kill You]

COMPLETELY mature? Nope. A few mature songs? Can almost count on it.

[Mr. Porter]

I thought everyone wanted the old Eminem? smh.

He will never be able to please his stans.

He's pleased me multiple times

If we know what you mean...

[kkaniff]

Even his serious songs now, he has to use immature lines like "nipple is mine for the milking". Come on.

Uhhh, in what fucking world are you living in if you think that line is immature? It's a clever metaphor about "owning" the rap game, and he's milking it (farmers OWN their animals, and milking them...).

Plus it's part of an even more clever wordplay with the "ML King/ milking".

ML King? What does it stand for? And should it not be MIL King?

ML king, Martin Luther King.had a dream..........

[Mr. Porter]

I also never cared for the nipple line. Thought it sounded dumb.

[Kill You]

"Had a dream I was king, I woke up, still king
This rap game's nipple is mine for the milking/ML King"

Get it now?...

I agree with Porter though, it is dumb.

[kkaniff]

"Had a dream I was king, I woke up, still king
This rap game's nipple is mine for the milking/ML King"

Get it now?...

I agree with Porter though, it is dumb.

i sorta mentally flinched when i heard it too.